Ladybank company of distillers.

[pcattera]

Good day good people. I am an overseas (Germany) founder member of the Ladybank company of distillers. Everthing to my mind was going fine until about January 2007. At this time I applied for ten shares (£1550) to help things progress. The money was duly transferred from account. Since this time I have had no shares, no further correspondence, no more online updates. My Emails are unanswered and the telephones appear disconnected. The web site (http://www.whisky.co.uk) is still active but for the last year a message in the members section (one can log in) says this section is currently being updated and you are referred to the online boardroom but this can not be accessed. I am desperate for information. Can anyone shed light on the status of Ladybank ? Best regards Peter

[whisky4me]

Hi,

Ladybank 'distillery' is on an estate to the east of Ladybank town and not far from Daftmill. Other than a new roof on the old building the place is derelict - and has been for some time.

The accounts for the company(s) are overdue with companies house.

Probably not what you wanted to hear but I hope this brings some closure.

[MacDeffe]

in 2001 I bought, together with a bunch of friends a 9 liter share of a Bowmore cask (1/35 of the cask)

From the same person/company/people "operating" Ladybank

After loads of struggle we finally managed to get our bottles. It involved the cask being transfered to 3rd party agent and the shareholders suddenly got told they had full responsibility to bottle and get the whisky themselves. Just think of the troubles finding and getting in touch with 34 others

When the cask was bottled finally the cask somehow had lost so much of its contest that the my original 9l share had shrunk to 4-5 bottles. thats 2.8-3.5 litres

I was quite surprised that this "leaking" cask still managed to hold an alcohol percentage of 59.5

It took 2 years of Bureaucracy to get the bottles from the 3rd party agent (Mainly getting hold of as many shareholders as possible).
I don't hold anything against the 3rd party agent, who probably regret all the troubles they were let into by our original seller.

I can only say I will stay as far away from these people as I can and that I am on personal level very happy the small amount I invested. I'm a bit sorry I dragged a few friends, including my mother into sharing with me, but luckily I had most of them around for some heavy dramming several times they easily forgive me loosing ½ bottle whisky each

I wouldn't keep any hopes up if I was you. It's a shame that an entusiast like you have been conned.

If anyone around this forum has bought ½ a cask of Bowmore 1989 a couple of years ago I would like to hear from you !

Macdeffe

[pcattera]

Thank you for your responses. As you say, not what I wanted to hear but I suppose expected. Ok I joined the Ladybank project because it seemed so well organised. The membership literature web site etc. very professional. There was always the risk of the project failing and as an investor, I can accept that but not having the backbone to tell the members it had failed, I find shameful. However, the setting up of the second company which would put shares on the open market (or so I believed ) is a different matter. Ladybank accepted my money for the purchase of shares and no shares have been forthcoming. This is would appear to be a criminal fraud. Are there other people out there who are members of Ladybank, who may or may not have put in for shares ? If so it would seem that collective action is called for. Being in Germany, I have not much access to the authorities who could deal with this but I would certainly join group action if there is a group. Maybe I was the only one, however, I doubt this as the money I paid overall (circa £5000) would not cover the membership joining pack literature. If there are other members interested in doing something but would rather keep it private, my Email is catterall_peter@hotmail.com Investment risk is one thing, fraud is another. I hope to hear from others either in this forum or privately. Regards Peter

[jmrl]

Good luck. I hope justice is served.

Any update with Blackwoods in Shetland? Another unfortunate episode.

[Iain]

Over on the site-with-no-name, the site owner has posted an update from the company, 18 March, which says that Ladybank is planning to "release" the next tranche of 50 memberships. Nos 400 to 450.

Go to the WWW forum (pm me if you need the url - I don't think we are permitted to post it here), then select Whisky News, and then "Ladybank" (currently 4th topic from top).

What a peculiar story...

[Deactivated Member]

The Ponzi malt? I hate to slander anyone who just might be people of good will doing their best to get a distillery going, but I know I wouldn't consider buying a membership in an enterprise when the current members can't get a response to direct inquiry. They aren't doing themselves any favors there.

[pcattera]

Good day to all, as the Ladybank founder member who originally posted this topic, I would like to post an update. I have now been contacted by the chairman of Ladybank and we have had an indepth discussion. I am now completely satisfied that there is no case of improprietry as regards the share issue, the issue of which I have had confirmed by Company House. My appologies to the chairman for any percieved allegations. Although for sure, the project has and is continuing to encounter hard times, I am assured that it is still ongoing. I hope that in future, the flow of information to both members and shareholders of Ladybank will improve and that the tide of fortune will turn. One point that I still find strange is that so far, only one other member/shareholder has contacted me. Surely, there are others out there who still have a hope that this project can succeed. Come on make contact, put your mouth where your money is, the more voices the stronger we are. After all it is as much our project as the chairman's. Regards, Peter

[braid]

I am a founding member of Ladybank also. Last spring, a few of us posted some comments in the member's section of Ladybank's website. Needless to say, they were all negative, and that part of the website was quickly taken down. Then, as now, I am completely disgusted with the lack of information made available to members. Lots of promises and no results. A great example of how not to operate a company. I would love someone to show me how to get my money back.

Scott Braid Canada

[julesl]

Hello, another disgruntled early member of Ladybank here. Highly miffed. I once met James...... a long time ago. Had not even tried to get in touch, assuming work was ongoing, until recently. Yes, no access on web, etc., etc.

I would like to get any real news of what is happening - I was intending to head up there in August to take a look round.

Jules

[ploughboy]

I see there was a small article in the Dundee Courier about the lack of progress at ladybank. hope this link works http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2009 ... 8092t0.asp

[Iain]

In addition, I read Peter's letter in Saturday's "Guardian" Money supplement, and the reply from Tony Levene in what will be his final column in the supplement. He has done a good job (as usual) in getting some answers. (As has the Courier, of course)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/ju ... ery-whisky

[FirewallXL5]

That Guardian article appears to signify the end of any realistic hopes for this project. Sad.
The possibility of 'some' bottles (number unspecified) maybe in 10 years sounds more like whistling in the dark than a real prospect.
Does the explanation for the failure entirely stand up to scrutiny?
It appears from this article that they burned through £750,000 in cash between 2003 and 2006, with what to show for it?
Being caught out on still sizes seems unlikely, other 'micro' projects at LochEwe, Daftmill (& Red River) seem to have coped, I wonder what their still size and capital requirements were.

[jacquesh]

Hi Everybody,

I very disapointed about these news. Disapointed but not really surprised ;-((
I was founding member of Ladybank too. As everybody, I suppose, end of 2007 I was asked to pay again for new shares. Hopefully, I didn't had time enough to do it !!!
If there is any way to get back my money, it would be great

Jacques (from France)

[WhiskyLady]

I have also participated in an "investment" in Ladybank distillery and after several discussions with Mr Thomson have come to the painful conclusion that I will never see any return on my investment.
Whether this is a fraud or not will only become apparent after investigations into the activities of Mr Thomson and any persons associated with him in connection with the distillery.
In particular it needs to be established what has happened to the money invested with the "enterprise" and whether it was spent in accordance with the promises made to investors. The drawing of a salary by Mr Thomson would not be appropriate I feel. Money "disappearing" to unexplained destinations could indicate a fraud. Money genuinely being spent on the setting up of a distillery and supported by receipt , whilst not perhaps a fraud, may still render Mr Thomson liable to accusations of mismanagement and incompetence.
I reside locally to the site of the proposed distillery and can confirm that the buildings are pretty much ruins, that the Hill Street address is only a pick up point for mail and that Mr Thomson is almost impossible to contact. A visit to Companies House would only make the enquirer feel worse about the situation.
I am convinced that the best resort would be to report the matter to the authorities. If there is sufficient interest I am prepared to collate a response to the situation on behalf of investors and can provide a contact point if required.
WhiskyLady

[daveski]

There but for the grace of God go I. I was almost tempted to invest back in 2005, but my better half persuaded me not to - apparently saving for a wedding was more important!.

I was sold, though, on the idea of a return of a number of bottles over a prolonged period, as well as the ability to visit your own distillery and stay for the weekend.

I hope that a realistic answer is received or that justice is forthcoming - whichever is appropriate.

D

[r900p]

Has anyone contacted the authorities, or is everyone just saying the best thing to do is contact the authorities?

[driver]

Hallo! I am also an "investor" from 2003 (member 292) and I am a little bit sour of loosing my 1850 pounds. In May 2006 I and my 3 brothers actually visited James Thomson and he showed us the lovely surroundings, the ruines, and the visions. It was before the poolish roofs. I now follow this discussion with interest. I have no hope to get back whisky OR money from this peoples but I do want the whole story on the board.

[WhiskyLady]

There seems to be some interest on this site in reporting this matter. We are sure there is a HUGE interest as there are allegedly over 400 members "investing" perhaps £3000 each. The trouble is that many of us are overseas and also making contact with each other. Making contact of course should be easy but as Thomson has closed down the member's forums and discussion sites, he has deliberately placed difficulties in our way. We would encourage anyone with an interest, particularly if they reside within the UK, to contact us at osker@sky.com and it IS our intention to report the matter. After all not a single promise that Thomson has made has been carried out. We have photographic evidence of the lack of progress at the site, having attended there only last week.
425 times £3250 is £1.4 MILLION and having attended at the site recently there is no change from 2 years ago. A single new roof was put on perhaps 3-5 years ago but we would estimate the likely cost as being little more than £10000 leaving almost the entire amount apparently unspent, although Thomson claims to have little cash left?
Someone in authority needs to use their powers to examine the company/club records and determine what has happened to the funds invested by us with Thomson. Evidence of criminality should be reported.

[nickytam]

I also am a founder member (Number 107) and read with interest all previous posts. I am certain that the money is gone and that the Ladybank distillary will never be a reality.
I live locally and have visited the site many times including last week, and can report no progress in the last 2 years. I again sent a message to Thomson a week ago and have had no reply (as expected).
If there were any hope of a Phoenix rising from this mess Mr Thomson would be responding to these messages?

[Iain]

It's easy with hindsight to say this was a disaster waiting to happen. But I think that's unfair on the stakeholders, who went into all this with genuine enthusiasm and good faith. Mr Thomson did and does not have a good reputation for "delivering the goods" and I think that it in future it is beholden on everyone here to share info (gentle warnings are all that is required) about anyone making offers re whisky enterprises, before and not after the sh*t hits the fan.

ps: can I point out that Mr T is still toutiong for business at

http://www.scotchwhisky.com/

where he continues to offer advice on whisky investments. And you can still sign up for the Ladybank News !

These pages are still on-line for potential invstors (!)

http://www.scotchwhisky.com/dec/ladybank.html

[WhiskyLady]

As our concerns, over the non building of a Ladybank distillery and Mr Thomson continuing to hold on to the investment funds totalling over a million pounds, were reported to the police last month, we would encourage any like minded investors to contact us at osker@sky.com to in order that a list of complainers are available to assist the police with their enquiries. As it is unlikely the matter will be investigated twice there is only a short period of time to provide your details. As Mr (and Mrs ) Thomson continue to not respond to any attempts to contact them, it seems increasingly obvious that they intend to hold on to our cash. The Ladybank group of companies continue to be in default at Companies House, Edinburgh with no accounts or annual returns being filed. Anyone looking up such records can obtain Thomsons home address in West Lothian, near Edinburgh and he/they clearly have funds available if anyone is interested in pursuing them civilly through legal or court proceedings. Thank you to those investors who have contacted us so far.

[nickytam]

I notice that no new comments have been posted here for some time now and get the feeling that this particular activity may be running out of steam. (other than that of whiskylady's) It may be that a high percentage of Ladybank members are not familiar with this site.

Does anyone know if Mr Thomson has any other sites where we can post our views, ask questions or inform others of the Ladybank situation. Or for that matter any site that could be used to make Mr Thomson communicate to All Ladybank Members. It may also be a way of making other members aware of this forum thereby increasing the weight of feeling and impetus for some kind of collective action in the future.

James, why not stop all this nonsense now by posting your own views on the matter...You owe us that at least?

[WhiskyLady]

Nicky, thanks for your contribution. We are NOT running out of steam. We have a list of members that are not going to put up with Mr Thomson retaining our investment cash without carrying out his promise of building a distillery. The list is growing weekly and later this month will be passed over to the police as a list of "complainers" regarding the allegation of fraud they are already investigating. This is the only chance for persons unhappy with the situation to make official representation to the police regarding being possibly defrauded and I would encourage you to make us aware of your complaint. Nicky Tam I notice you have not done this yet. As regards Mr Thomson being given a forum to answer the allegations, he has his own site at the Ladybank Distillery site and clearly has no answers to give us ( or intentions of returning any money). He has run out of time and we (on the list) are not putting up with the situation any longer whether we live in Scotland, the UK or overseas. Mr (and Mrs) Thomson have plenty of assets including a house, a farm building and land and cars etc, and a lot of money in the bank (that does not belong to them) so they can afford to return the investment monies that we entrusted them with. Thanks everyone for your continued support and feel free to contact us at osker@sky.com or through this page. The Thomsons activities bring discredit on the whisky industry and the people of Scotland. Please believe this sort of behaviour from the Thomsons is as unusual in Scotland as elsewhere in the world!.

[nickytam]

Well, that's put me in my place!...I did not mean to belittle your's or anyone elses efforts, I just tried to give the subject another little push.

[Ian Buxton]

Hello all,
I am writing an article on this and other ventures (e.g. Shetland) for the next issue issue of Whisky Magazine.
If you would care to be quoted with factual information and comment regarding the situation please send me a private message via this forum.
Please only get in touch if you are willing to be quoted in print and only with facts - no rants please! Thanks,
Ian Buxton

[ploughboy]

Anything new happening here?

[dramlover]

I am another disappointed founder member (No. 280). I also reside overseas (USA), which makes things difficult to evaluate.

The main reason for this late post is that I did not visit the Ladybank site for a couple of years -- the last time was in 2008, when the 'upgrades' to the site where begun. An hour ago, paying a visit, I realised that something was sorely amiss. It did not take long to find out what has been going on. I did not know about this forum till today.

I greatly appreciate Peter Catterall for starting this thread and WhiskyLady's taking up the matter with the authorities.

As some have bluntly said, this seems to an investment gone sour. I am lucky in that the outlay for US memeberships was not as high when I joined the club as they later became and the exchange rate was indeed very favourable. I am sorry to see that many locally located members only paid higher entry fees only to personally see little progress being made on the distillery.

Any updates on what has happened in the year since the last post by WhiskyLady would be greatly appreciated.

[whatwhiskey]

Hi - not sure if anyone else has managed to find anything more out about the whole mess, we reported them to the police, companies house and got solicitors involved - it seems that Mr Furness and his marquee hire company remain resoloutely quite on any letters sent and James (Doughty Vert?) Thomson gave a big talk about how none of it was his fault and that everyone else seemed to have ripped them off or given really bad service to the group but that they had someone who was looking at taking the project over. We did not even get registered as shareholders at companies house despite an email confirmation from Ladybank that we were - even this does not seem to constitute fraud in scotland. I cannot believe that you still seem able to link and send emails to join ladybank via their website - WHAT A SCAM, hope all involved sleep well at night after living high off the hogg (or is that living high off other peoples money)

[dramlover]

Has anyone heard about what is happening with the Baker and Lilly work?

I received a mailing from them asking me to formally join in the proceedings against
Ladybank and the liquidisation procedures. I had some doubts about what to fill in, but
a note to Victoria Paterson at Baker & Lilly just got we an "out of office" reply and I have had no further contact with the law firm. It is about 5 months since I mailed in the forms, filled in to the best of my ability.

Are there any active processes going on?

Anyway, I think it is all money under the sewage now ..... But, would like
to hear what is going on.

thanks

[I prefer bourbon]

I too was a UK "founding member" of the club (Number 110). I have not paid it much attention since then as the membership was bought for a former partner who I am no longer with. The membership was in my name but at an old postal and email address and it's only just recently that I have discovered the "problems"! I know it sounds blase to forget about £1800 but it was such a long time ago and I don't really like whisky myself!

Does anyone know what has happened? Like the previous poster, I fear this was an expensive gamble, gone wrong, but would like to hear if anyone knows the current situation .....

PM if you like at rebecca.jobs@hotmail.co.uk

Rebecca