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Smoke Free Scotland

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Should smoking be banned in Pubs?

Yes - I hate smoke filled rooms
31
76%
No - it breaches the human right of choice
10
24%
 
Total votes : 41

Smoke Free Scotland

Postby Deactivated Member » Sun Mar 26, 2006 11:27 am

The smoking ban has started in scotland. From today smoking is prohibited in all pubs and restaurants and any other public gathering.
Simple question - for or against?

I am in favour of the ban. I rarely visit pubs purely because I end up smelling like and ashtray the next day and invariably get a sore throat.

I can, however, see merit in having "smoking" pubs. You pays your money you takes your choice!
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Postby parvus » Sun Mar 26, 2006 12:45 pm

We passed a smoke-free law in New Zealand last year, it is a fantastic thing. I respect the right of people to enjoy a fine cuban or a cigarette every now and then, but one or two smoking gits can destroy an entire bars air.

My friend told me that they allow smoking at the SMWS bars/lounges, I was pretty amazed that people drinking there would put up with that kind of carry on.

Voted for.
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Postby lambda » Sun Mar 26, 2006 2:10 pm

I don't like going to many pubs for various reasons, smoke, loud music, obnoxious other customers (caused by alcohol maybe?). But, I don't see a good reason why pub owners should be forced to change their rules. If you don't like it, don't go there.
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Postby Aidan » Sun Mar 26, 2006 2:20 pm

lambda wrote:I don't like going to many pubs for various reasons, smoke, loud music, obnoxious other customers (caused by alcohol maybe?). But, I don't see a good reason why pub owners should be forced to change their rules. If you don't like it, don't go there.


I think the idea is as much to protect the staff as it is to protect the customer. I think it's a good think. It's worked brilliantly here in Ireland, and if it works here, it will work anywhere.

Again, it's not really about choice, as your choices impinge on other people's choices. I do think there should be clubs where smokers can go and maybe it should be allowed in family run pubs.

Anyway, it benefits the vast majority to the people.
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Postby Paul A Jellis » Sun Mar 26, 2006 3:01 pm

I am probably in the minority now as an occasional smoker. I enjoy a really good cigar with a dram, something I can no longer do in Scotland (or Ireland).

We recently had a short stay in Chester and the restaurant that we dined in had a smoking lounge, a well ventilated room that the staff had no reason to enter, the bar was in another room. This, for me, is a much better arrangement and better for the restaurant, we stayed much longer and drank more from the bar! They also had a good selection of fine cigars.

I agree that something had to be done, I don't like people smoking around me when I'm eating and I wouldn't do it to them. But a blanket ban is going to far. I believe the answer was to have well ventilated smoking areas and I don't mean outside!

We stopped going to Ireland when the smoking ban came in, but it will take more than this to stop me going to Scotland. Plastic glasses are more of a problem!

Cheers

Paul
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Postby Scotchio » Sun Mar 26, 2006 3:39 pm

As a chap who has finally packed in the evil weed after 23 years of addiction I am totally behind any bans imposed.I've had numerous false starts in packing in often caused by relapses in pubs when friends have had fags. A ban makes packing in easier. Let smokers smoke outside the fresh air may do them some good.
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Postby ianbanks » Sun Mar 26, 2006 3:54 pm

Hello

This is a good thing. I think it may drive people away from places (or countries) where you cannot have a smoke but these people will be replaced by people who would not go in before. I am a smoker and I hope this will help me stop.

Ian
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Postby Deactivated Member » Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:10 pm

I hate smoke filled rooms, but I would not object to pubs and restaurants offering "Smoke Rooms" for those who want to partake.

WH
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Postby Deactivated Member » Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:38 pm

I am beside myself with joy at this (and I'm not at all sure that Joy can handle two of me), and cannot wait to get back. Sorry, smokers, no one cares what you do to yourselves, but smoking infringes on the rights of others to a breath of air. The "You don't have to go there" argument doesn't wash. If there were an equitable way to allow smokers to light up without imposing on nonsmokers, I'd be for it, but I am skeptical--every such proposal seems to have the potential for abuse or inequity.

I also think smoking should be banned within fifty feet of the front door.
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Smoke Free Scotland

Postby Danny » Sun Mar 26, 2006 6:36 pm

Totally suportive. I have not smoked now for 22 years, but tried to quit several times before really making it. Usually started again in the bar or pub.

Here in British Columbia resturants and bars have a smoking room for those that smoke. The balance of the establishment is smoke free. Seems to work okay.

We travel lots and when in countries that allow smoking in public places it is sometimes quite offensive in resturants.
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Postby Lawrence » Sun Mar 26, 2006 6:43 pm

In the greater Victoria area there is no indoor smoking in bars and restaurants and despite dire predictions from industry the transition was a non event. As a bonus those who stayed home because of smoke intolerance started coming back and the smokers, after sulking for a few weeks, also came back and now huddle outside every few minutes for their fix.

I think Scotland will find out eventually that it's the right course to follow since the health effects on the staff was very severe.
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Postby Spirit of Islay » Sun Mar 26, 2006 7:40 pm

As i've stated already on another forum and got berated for it , i'm over the moon that smokings been stopped in public areas (and i'm an ex-smoker...) . It'll be great to go into a pub and not come out stinking , not have the smell of stale Cigarettes spoiling the pints and drams .
It's just a shame we'll have to wait another year here south of the border for it to become law .
BTW there's a notice on the SMWS site that it'll come into effect at their Venues (The Vaults when the building works finished ) , we were a bit worried it wouldn't (don't know if there's a private club exemption) so we'll be able to enjoy our drams all day now without the smoke ! :D

Glad to see so many here are behind the ban !
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Postby Mr Ellen » Sun Mar 26, 2006 7:49 pm

I agree with most of the speakers here. They have banned smoking in public places here in Stockholm too and I think it's fantastic finally being able to sit in a pub or bar and smell something else than tobacco.
I have on several occasions turned at the door because there has been so much smoke filling the pub. And after just 10-15 minutes you stink like an ashtray and it sure gets you a sore throat and headache.
I'm really glad they put up this ban and it will sure make me staying a little longer in the pubs I'll visit. :D :D

Cheers
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Postby Lord_Pfaffin » Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:00 pm

Smoking tobbacco will make you and the others in your proximity sick eventually. Long overdue that this habit becomes a social pyriah.
If you want to smoke something, there are much better things to be smoked, that will actually do something for you rather than make you ill. Switching from tobbacco to pot would not make your smoking habit any less offensive but it would definately adjust your attitude for you and it does go better with a wee whisky. :wink:
All kidding aside. The smoking ban is a good thing, i just hope that everyone takes it seriously, it's a life saver.
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Postby Lawrence » Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:17 pm

Switching from tobbacco to pot



Toronto has gone to pot.

With apologies to Mr. T for stealing a pun.
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Postby Aidan » Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:38 pm

Paul A Jellis wrote:I am probably in the minority now as an occasional smoker. I enjoy a really good cigar with a dram, something I can no longer do in Scotland (or Ireland).

We recently had a short stay in Chester and the restaurant that we dined in had a smoking lounge, a well ventilated room that the staff had no reason to enter, the bar was in another room. This, for me, is a much better arrangement and better for the restaurant, we stayed much longer and drank more from the bar! They also had a good selection of fine cigars.

I agree that something had to be done, I don't like people smoking around me when I'm eating and I wouldn't do it to them. But a blanket ban is going to far. I believe the answer was to have well ventilated smoking areas and I don't mean outside!

We stopped going to Ireland when the smoking ban came in, but it will take more than this to stop me going to Scotland. Plastic glasses are more of a problem!

Cheers

Paul


It's a shame that you don't come over anymore, but that's your choice. I suppose Ireland would not be the destination of choice for cigar clubs. Others will come for the very opposite reason, though.

I think that we'll look back at this in a few years and wonder why it was not done years ago. During the Embassy World Snooker, they used to go around with trays of complementary cigarettes. normal at the time, but looking back...
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Postby Dan G » Sun Mar 26, 2006 10:06 pm

MrTattieHeid wrote:Sorry, smokers, no one cares what you do to yourselves, but smoking infringes on the rights of others to a breath of air. The "You don't have to go there" argument doesn't wash. If there were an equitable way to allow smokers to light up without imposing on nonsmokers, I'd be for it, but I am skeptical--every such proposal seems to have the potential for abuse or inequity.

I also think smoking should be banned within fifty feet of the front door.


This pretty much sums up my view. What smokers seem to miss in laws like this is that they can still go into bars, just not smoke there. For me, who is allergic to smoke, it has never been a matter of having a choice like that - my options have been stay away from places with smoke or end up vomiting (or worse). Even being outdoors near someone smoking makes me nauseous.

A small tourist town in the mountains near here was debating the 50 foot rule recently and realized that meant no smoking in the downtown area except in the middle of intersections. I'd be all for that.

I can't wait to return to Scotland - I liked the pubs there but couldn't spend any time length of time in them. Irish pubs, however, probably had a banner year financially after my trip there in 2004!
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Postby Deactivated Member » Sun Mar 26, 2006 10:41 pm

Lawrence wrote:
Switching from tobbacco to pot



Toronto has gone to pot.

With apologies to Mr. T for stealing a pun.


You can have the really obvious ones, Lawrence! :P

Lord P seems to have a novel take on enjoying a weed dram.
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Smoking ban

Postby Muskrat Portage » Sun Mar 26, 2006 11:00 pm

MrTattieHeid wrote:I am beside myself with joy at this (and I'm not at all sure that Joy can handle two of me), ... I also think smoking should be banned within fifty feet of the front door.

Mr. T:
If Joy can handle me, she could certainly put up with you and your evil twin, Mr. Picky. ( My wife is Joy) We've had the smoking ban in most restaurants since last summer and criminals haven't been able to smoke for several years while in custody. So finally the Scots have the same privileges that Ontario criminal element have. It's 30 metres from the doors in public places here (ie: Hospitals, Gov't bldgs).
My wife, the aforementioned Joy, cannot enter a smoking allowed establishment without immediately plugging right up. The ban has allowed us to go to more venues together, a very good thing.
For the record, I'm against smoking in public places, however I can also see the erosion of persons' rights in this. I have "heard" that in a Scandinavian country it's illegal to smoke outside in your own yard. Such draconian measures, if true, mark a trail for the anti-tobacco lobby to follow. :twisted: Muskrat Portage.
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Postby Lord_Pfaffin » Sun Mar 26, 2006 11:14 pm

Lawrence wrote:
Switching from tobbacco to pot



Toronto has gone to pot.

With apologies to Mr. T for stealing a pun.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah with British Columbian bud! :wink:
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Postby Virginia Gentleman » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:39 am

I am all for this. You can always step outside if you need a smoke.
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Postby rifkin » Mon Mar 27, 2006 2:17 am

Norway was one of the first countries in the world which passed a legislation which banned smoking in public areas (pubs, restaurants, cafés, bus-terminals, airports etc).

I must say it has worked spendid. I for one do not smoke, nevertheless it is great to not smell like an ashtray after a night out on the town. :wink:

This is just a though, but I think the smoking "culture" in UK/Australia/US is vastly bigger than in Norway. Not just because of the obviously larger population, but as a big multi billion dollar exporter of tobacco products.
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Postby Aidan » Mon Mar 27, 2006 7:05 am

"No - it breaches the human right of choice"

Eskimos also have their right of choice curbed in Ireland as they are not allowed swing a bola about their heads within two metres of anyone else. Nanny state gone mad.
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:12 pm

In Glasgow at the week-end and it was the last week-end before the ban. Didi not hear too many people overly complaining about the ban. However from my experiences in Ireland the smoke in Glasgow pubs was no where near as bad as in irish pubs. I found them relatively pleasent as smokey enviroment go and I can tell you I visited a fair few establishments while I was there :wink: .Ii smoke the odd cigar and can understand people getting upset from my noxious fumes as cigars are pretty smelly beasts and I am all for the ban but that means that I have very few opertunities to smoke a relaxed cigar now as I don't smoke at home either. However that is not a bad thing and I have never begrudged non smokers there clean air.

There is one other major draw back to the ban though which people may not have realised. Now that smoking is gone there is nothing to cover any other interesting odours which prevail in the pub environment :wink: These range from B.O. to disinfectant or stale beer to perfume/after shave from an over eager hand :wink: You have been warned :mrgreen:
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Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:40 pm

Excellent point there IWC.

I look forward to the day when smoking is banned in Bayern too.
But at the same time a law should also be passed to enforce the local male population to use deodorant, as the majority don't seem to know of its existence.

:shock:
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:27 pm

WhiskyHammer wrote:Excellent point there IWC.

I look forward to the day when smoking is banned in Bayern too.
But at the same time a law should also be passed to enforce the local male population to use deodorant, as the majority don't seem to know of its existence.

:shock:


And maybe a shower would not go astray either :roll:
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Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Mar 27, 2006 7:07 pm

Aidan wrote:"No - it breaches the human right of choice"

Eskimos also have their right of choice curbed in Ireland as they are not allowed swing a bola about their heads within two metres of anyone else. Nanny state gone mad.


Please, Aidan! Those fine people are properly known as "Inuit". "Eskimo" is a Cree word meaning "eaters of raw flesh", a term at which the Inuit take umbrage. Ask your doctor if umbrage is right for you.

:wink:
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Postby Aidan » Mon Mar 27, 2006 7:48 pm

MrTattieHeid wrote:
Aidan wrote:"No - it breaches the human right of choice"

Eskimos also have their right of choice curbed in Ireland as they are not allowed swing a bola about their heads within two metres of anyone else. Nanny state gone mad.


Please, Aidan! Those fine people are properly known as "Inuit". "Eskimo" is a Cree word meaning "eaters of raw flesh", a term at which the Inuit take umbrage. Ask your doctor if umbrage is right for you.

:wink:


You're right - My apologies to any of the Inuit members of the discussion board - it was insensitive of me. In championing your right to swing a bola, I had forgotten what was really important.
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Postby Photon » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:03 am

Aidan wrote:
MrTattieHeid wrote:
Aidan wrote:"No - it breaches the human right of choice"

Eskimos also have their right of choice curbed in Ireland as they are not allowed swing a bola about their heads within two metres of anyone else. Nanny state gone mad.


Please, Aidan! Those fine people are properly known as "Inuit". "Eskimo" is a Cree word meaning "eaters of raw flesh", a term at which the Inuit take umbrage. Ask your doctor if umbrage is right for you.

:wink:


You're right - My apologies to any of the Inuit members of the discussion board - it was insensitive of me. In championing your right to swing a bola, I had forgotten what was really important.


Not to beat you up, but I think you got the wrong end of the continental landmass. Bolas are used by South American gauchos to help corral their cattle.

-P.
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Postby Lawrence » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:41 am

It's true, here in Canada the only Eskimo we see is in Eskimo Pie, vanilla ice cream between cookies /cake or is it just covered in chocolate?

In any case as long as they don't smoke inside their igloos. I suspect some might swing feather boas but I can't be sure.
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Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:46 am

Or soave bolla? What, no raw flesh in those Eskimo Pies? Can you smoke in a Nanaimo Bar?
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Postby Aidan » Tue Mar 28, 2006 6:14 am

Photon wrote:
Aidan wrote:
MrTattieHeid wrote:
Aidan wrote:"No - it breaches the human right of choice"

Eskimos also have their right of choice curbed in Ireland as they are not allowed swing a bola about their heads within two metres of anyone else. Nanny state gone mad.


Please, Aidan! Those fine people are properly known as "Inuit". "Eskimo" is a Cree word meaning "eaters of raw flesh", a term at which the Inuit take umbrage. Ask your doctor if umbrage is right for you.

:wink:


You're right - My apologies to any of the Inuit members of the discussion board - it was insensitive of me. In championing your right to swing a bola, I had forgotten what was really important.


Not to beat you up, but I think you got the wrong end of the continental landmass. Bolas are used by South American gauchos to help corral their cattle.

-P.


Hi Photon - I know the gaucho used bolas, but so did the Inuit. The inequity in Irish society lies in the fact that the gaucho can swing his bola with impunity over here, but the Inuit is restricted to doing it in specified areas under strict supervision.

http://gamesmuseum.uwaterloo.ca/Virtual ... /bola.html
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Postby Paul A Jellis » Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:29 am

but the Inuit is restricted to doing it in specified areas under strict supervision


I'd like to apply for the job of 'Bola Swinging Inuit Supervisor'. Probably get a bit busy in Summer but I can handle that!

Cheers

Paul
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:38 pm

Lawrence wrote:It's true, here in Canada the only Eskimo we see is in Eskimo Pie, vanilla ice cream between cookies /cake or is it just covered in chocolate?

In any case as long as they don't smoke inside their igloos. I suspect some might swing feather boas but I can't be sure.



We call them ice burgers :lol:
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Postby Aidan » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:49 pm

Paul A Jellis wrote:
but the Inuit is restricted to doing it in specified areas under strict supervision


I'd like to apply for the job of 'Bola Swinging Inuit Supervisor'. Probably get a bit busy in Summer but I can handle that!

Cheers

Paul


Paul, there are no surviving supervisors with experience in the industry, so you'd have a good chance.
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