Do you have a bottle/s you are not drinking because....

[killerwhale]

.... it is so rare or expensive or some other reason that you have not opened it?

If so, are you planning on passing the scotch on to your children or selling or drinking at some undecided time in the future?

Here is the point of my question; if you have such a bottle and are waiting for the right moment, are you not afraid that moment will never come? Perhaps an accident will occur and you may not be able to drink it?
I know it's good to keep special scotches for great occasions though how long does one wait? Isn't life special enough to celebrate any time?
I'm not sure I would hold off drinking a special scotch for years and years and years hoping the right moment came........

perhaps one falls into more than one option, however, just pick the closest that reflects your situation.

opinions and stories welcome.

[Deactivated Member]

I voted for "Waiting for the right moment". I have quite a few of these, actually, and I'm trying to get out of the hoarding mindset. Your signature says it best.

[mxyzptlk]

I am also waiting for the right moment. I'm rather fresh in the world of whisky and have only been enjoying single malts for a little over a year, this is the first time I've received a bottle of whisky without opening it the same evening or the day after. With the Talisker 30, though, it's both too rare and too expensive to just open and "chug" away. I definitely agree with you though, life's too short and all that. I'm going to open it with a good whisky loving friend or two, I suspect not too long from now.

[Wave]

I have a lot of bottles in this catagory, for example:

Caol Ila 25yr old 1976 Signatory Vintage Cask Strength
Highland Park 18yo Cadenhead bottled in '97
Port Ellen 24yr old 1978 The Whisky Shop 10th Anniversary Bottling
and several Bruichladdich Valinch's

But still...
I'm waiting for a good moment to open it, when that is, I'm not really sure.


Cheers!

[mikeymad]

I am with Wave. I have a couple.

Bowmore 31yo 1964 ( 49%, Original Bottling, The Black Bowmore 1964-1995 in box number 970:Last edition )
Bowmore 40yo 1966 ( 43.2%, Duncan Taylor, Cask 3312, 47/130, 5.66:5.06, in box )
Highland Park 20+yo 1906 ( 20up%, Gloag's Perth, Wax sealed screw top )
Linkwood 42yo 1939 ( 40%, Gordon & MacPhail, Black and White label )
Macallan 52yo 1946 ( 40%, Original Bottling, The 1946 wood box with scroll and key )
Macallan 25+yo 1950 ( 43%, Original Bottling, 1950 edition in wooden box with sliding door )
MacPhail's 45yo 1938 ( 40%, Gordon & MacPhail, Book of Kells label )
Mortlach 50yo 1936 ( 40%, Gordon & MacPhail, Book of Kells label: in box and decanter )
Mortlach 50yo 1942 ( 40%, Gordon & MacPhail, Book of Kells label: in box and decanter )
Mortlach 60yo 1938 ( 40%, Gordon & MacPhail, crystal bottle )
Springbank 30yo ( 46%, Original Bottling, Millennium edition 700ml: in box )
Springbank 40yo ( 40.1%, Original Bottling, Millennium edition 700ml: in box )
Springbank 50yo ( 40.5%, Original Bottling, Millennium edition 700ml: in box )

What to do......

[peergynt323]

I have moved away now, so often the right moment is when I go down to visit my family and friends and we have a barbecue or dinner. The feel-good factor is so high that even JW Red tastes good.

Another good place to smuggle a rare single malt would be on vacation like in Vegas.

[Deactivated Member]

Killerwhale,
this is indeed a very old discussion within all whisky circles and you have approached this, like many others, from the point of view of a "drinker".

I do like a dram or two, but I am also an avid whisky collector and would like to put forward a slightly different view.

Let's start with a question back to you:
Do you have any money in your wallet which you haven't eaten as yet?
If so, then why?
Many currencies make great sandwiches so why not eat all your money today?
Right now in fact!


OK, so that may seem rather silly as we all know money can be spent or even saved. If you put your money into a bank account they will even give you more for leaving it with them! If you are really lucky, certainly here in Germany, you just may be given around 4% per year. I know someone who has committed to a long term plan and is delighted to be receiving almost 6% per year.

So, let's look at a slightly different concept of a "savings plan", perhaps a retirement fund:
If I were to tell you that over a period of say 10-20 years, if you know what you are doing and select carefully, this "commodity" or savings plan could return an average "interest" of around 10% per year, might you be interested?
What if I told you that this "savings plan" comprised carefully selected bottles of whisky?
Also, as with all commodities, sometimes you may even be extremely lucky and multiply your initial investment two or three-fold in a very short time.
(Yes, you may be unlucky with some too and not gain any 'profit').

However, at the end of your 10-20 year savings plan, so long as you 'invested' wisely you should almost certainly see a very handsome return on your initial investment.


In summary, I would suggest that you (and many others) look at some bottlings in a slightly different way. Almost all whiskies are great to drink, but just some of them also hold great prospects for investment.
I know this is difficult, but try to look at this issue from two different sides:
1. The drinker - enjoy your drams that are open and don't feel guilty about drinking them.
2. The investor - Some bottles are definitely going to increase in value, certainly in the long-term. Don't be afraid to view these as a commodity or investment. Put them away, look after them and you will be rewarded.

Finally, for those who say keeping whisky like this removes it from general access to the 'drinkers', then I would remind you that in 10-20 years when such a collection is made available by a collector wishing to turn his investment into hard currency, then these great bottles will be available when otherwise they would have long disappeared!

MT

[les taylor]

Some good points there MT. So the question is :-

1. How do you know is going to be a good investment?

2. What would you invest in now?


Or is it that you would not say on a public forum because it endangers your investment opportunities.

[Deactivated Member]

Les, what I will say is that good prospects for investment are usually limited editions / special bottlings. The more limited, the better the prospect.
Ideally, they should also be dated / aged with bottle numbers and OB rather than IB. Although some IBs are right up there with the OBs.
(Just look at some of the Moon or Samaroli bottlings!)

As we all know, certain distilleries are very much "in vogue" - today Ardbeg is an excellent example, so is Glenmorangie and for some editions, Bruichladdich can fall into this category too.

Closed distilleries are also good prospects, certainly as stocks dwindle and become much harder to find.

One great example of another "in vogue" distillery has been Macallan. On an affordable level their older "classic label" 18y editions have proven excellent investment opportunities and I am sure will continue to do so.
But the new style range - these are no longer dated like the older ones and don't really hold much prospect.
The earlier Macallan and Glenmorangie "specials" commemorating specific events are also great ones to hold.

Yes, there are many possibilities, who knows which distilleries will suddenly be in the limelight in a few years time?
That's all part of the fun!
MT

[les taylor]

Thanks MT that sort of confirms what I already believed. You are right what I paid for some of my bottles and what they are making now, is a good return. Only I don't feel inclined to sell right now. Who knows about the future.

[killerwhale]

MT....
thanks for your posts. First off, let me make it clear that I in no way am 'frowning' upon one who wishes to collect and profit in the future, as Mr.T. pointed out, my siggy sums it up and I believe one can do as they please, does not bother me (aslong as one is not going around killing people or massively poisoning the water etc, and harming - in general, to each their own and more power to ya! )
I was curious more about some scotches that may be in the range of; 'I'm going to drink it but am waiting for the right moment, though the right moment has not been in years and years'. I wondered about what really are 'right moments' and if any who may be in this category are perhaps a tad nervous that they may not be able to experience said scotch/es ever due to death, disease or something unexpected.
Perhaps my question/poll was not clear enough as my musings went tumbling along in my head though I made it and will leave it be...... something to 'chew' on at least.
I hold no grudge for any who may collect scotch, it's just an option in the poll.

Lastly, thanks to all for your opinions/stories.

PS, scotch being held for definate dates are very understandable and Canadian Loonies taste aweful

[Dan G]

I voted for 'I drink them'. I'm still new enough to whisky, having only started drinking it 3 years ago, that I don't see the point in buying rare malts when there are so many common ones I still need to try. And I also don't have money to invest in it.
I almost voted for 'waiting for the right time to open it' because I do have several unopened bottles around, but I know exactly the right time to open them: when one of the others is empty.

[les taylor]

Dan G wrote:-

I almost voted for 'waiting for the right time to open it' because I do have several unopened bottles around, but I know exactly the right time to open them: when one of the others is empty.


Dan I like your reasoning simple and to the point.

[peergynt323]

As a finance guy, I consider investments things with guaranteed streams of income, so the only way I can see using whisky as an investment (as opposed to speculation) would be if you are a bar owner or a shop owner. The equity of your collection is not just in its dollar value, but in increased sales and the brand equity it gives your shop/bar.

In the end, whisky is worth whatever people are willing to pay for it.

Interesting fact: From 1940 to 2005, the median home price (US) increased 5.33 fold and the consumer price index increased 13.95 fold. If you invested a dollar in a DJIA index fund in 1940, you would have $68.18 in 2005.

[Ann-Helen]

I have to say I have to have 2 of everything (worth collecting) so that I can drink one and collect one.
I can`t imagine collecting without being able to taste it.

[Deactivated Member]

Ann-Helen,
that's a good strategy and one followed by many people. Although I hear some like to buy three as opposed to two.
That way they can drink one, sell one as the price rises and keep the third for longer-term.

MT

[Wave]

Or the 3-bottle strategy there you drink 2 and save 1!
(been there, done that)


Cheers!

[Deactivated Member]

That works too!

[DramMeister]

... it's a bottle of Ledaig NAS and I can't face another drop of it. It's been open about 2 years, I got half way down it.
Here's a question - when am I allowed to pour Malt Whisky down the plughole?

[killerwhale]

Here's a question - when am I allowed to pour Malt Whisky down the plughole?

DM....
give it to someone... or ask a few if they would like to try it as you can't finish it.... who knows, perhaps someone will like it and perhaps you'll get a laugh if they don't.... good for a story between friends I'd think.

[vitara7]

... it's a bottle of Ledaig NAS and I can't face another drop of it. It's been open about 2 years, I got half way down it.
Here's a question - when am I allowed to pour Malt Whisky down the plughole?

with ledaig id say from the second you bought the bottle....

but if it were any other whisky, thats a diffrent matter

[Paul A Jellis]

My vote went to - I drink them, otherwise it would be like going to Amsterdam and just LOOKING in the windows!

[Quaichuser]

I have reached the age where I'm a "drink as you go" type. As KW indicates....life is too short. I have a great collection of empties to remind me of times past.
Special occasions are every birthday and every anniversary and evenings with good friends who like whisky..those moments in time don't come back.
I guess I'm too practical as well. At a tasting a few months back I sampled a St Magdelene 21 yr old, an Inchgower 27 yr old, and a Banff Speyside 21yr old
They were all great whiskys and when someone asked if I would buy one I said I'd love to but I thought...how many Lagavulin DE's or Talisker 18yr or even Balvenie DBs could I buy instead.

That said I also admire those that can buy whisky to collect and not touch it. I don't have the wherewithal or the will power to do that sort of thing.
(Besides, the wife says I have too many other collections of things that take up space in the house)

If I may quote Don Henley ..I've never seen a hearse with a luggage rack."

And there is no dress rehersal for life. Enjoy it, however you like, but enjoy it.

[Mustardhead]

My vote went to "drink when the moment is right"

I do have a few more bottles than I need, but I am by nature a hoarder. However, I would like to aim to have a "rolling collection" so that I hoard hardly anything, if I buy something special, I open something special. Let's see if it works in practice.

[Di Blasi]

I have a few special bottles that I'm not sure when I'll get to open. Partly I've already seen some of them increase in value, but mostly because I like to open a special bottle now and then. Yes, once it's gone, bye bye! Either a bigger expense to replace, or rather a disapointment if it doesn't meet or exceed expectations. Maybe I should just flip a coin to see if I'll open it or not.

[Deactivated Member]

I only have a handful of single malts, but usually they are very good -- at least, to me; that's why I like them. Additionally, though, I have a number of rarer, older bourbons -- but nary a one I won't open at the right time.
In fact, I opened a Very Old Fitzgerald Bottled In Bond, distilled in 1956 and bottled in 1964, earlier this month in the company of several bourbon-aficianado friends. Personally, I valued it more in that company than for the doubling in monetary value I could have realized for it on eBay.
So, sure, whisk(e)y might be a potential collectible/investment, but that just isn't why it interests me. There's always the 'next big thing' to invest in, but a rare whiskey might never come along again. I'd rather experience it.

[Deactivated Member]

Once the money is out of my pocket, it ceases to be part of the equation. A bottle on my shelf is not potential money; it is a potential experience. Yes, I am a collector--a collector of experiences. A bottle unexperienced has no value to me yet. The bottles I have drunk are the ones I value most.

[killerwhale]

some good posts and opinions indeed.... thanks

now if only my poll will get someone to thinking and open that bottle that is being saved for the 'right moment', then have a great experience in their life, then all will be well

truly though, I am pleased to see that some go for experience and have the enjoyment.... for collectors, the enjoyment will come in future funds... and who knows, they probably have a few of the same and can drink one.... there are many 'right' moments in life, just depends how one veiws it...

[Ann-Helen]

I should have said at least 2 before because some we have 3 of (for example i actually got 3 bottles of Laphroaig 1988 vintage)
And to vitara 7 , it isn`t all Ledaig that is awful I kinda like the 15 yo and so definitivly the 1972 vintage.

[irishwhiskeychaser]

I said

'I'm waiting for a good moment to open it, when that is, I'm not really sure.'

But in saying that I'll be as honest as I can.

My Irish Whiskey collection is a collection which I do put a fincial value on and probably at some stage will sell off a lot of it but at the moment it is something that I actually enjoy looking at. However I do drink a lot of my stock and go with the buy 3 drink at least one but I know I will never get the opertunity to drink it all.

On the other hand I have a total different outlook on Bourbon and Scotch. I drink or hope to drink all of it and don't buy it for collecting. I do have a few 0ver 30year olds in stock at this stage and will hopefully drink them sooner rather than later. Like some, I'm waiting for a good occasion to open them.

[Frodo]

And to vitara 7 , it isn`t all Ledaig that is awful I kinda like the 15 yo

I really liked the 15yr Ledaig. Tasted like Talisker...

[Muskrat Portage]

GLEN ALBYN (Signatory)1974 (58%)
I've mentioned this bottling elsewhere in the past and it's being saved for my daughter to do as she sees fit. As many of you are aware, Glen Albyn is an extinct distillery, that location now is a parking lot.

And frankly, I have too many bottles open to even consider opening this one. The remainder in the Lair will at some point in time be opened and enjoyed as the Stillman didn't ply his craft for it to be admired on a plinth.
Muskrat
(On a side note, there is a new candidate location on the horizon for the Whisky Lair. Have to discuss it some more with the Missus. Edit: And there's a built in safe for the rare bottlings!)

[killerwhale]

On a side note, there is a new candidate location on the horizon for the Whisky Lair. Have to discuss it some more with the Missus. Edit: And there's a built in safe for the rare bottlings!)

that sounds very interesting indeed, hope all works out well

PS, TN I like your style

[middlecut]

Well I was firmly on the "lifes too short so drink it" side of the fence, but did manage to save my Lagavullin distillers edition for nearly a year before opening.

I said was, as having just read Malt-Teaser's excellent posts on investment I dont feel so uncomfortable with myself about wanting to buy that bottle of Port Ellen.

This begs now the question is "Port Ellen that sound investment or is the marketing of the releases persuading me?" (sorry... off topic)

[Deactivated Member]

In my opinion, OB Port Ellens are indeed sound releases because the whisky is excellent and the stocks are very limited and rapidly running out. I believe there will always be a demand for PEs which should ensure a buoyant market for anyone holding on to them for a few years.

MT