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Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby parvus » Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:10 am

Nick Brown wrote:SMK. The rules are there for everyone to see. One bottle for one member. The previous one was two bottles per member. The reason for the restriction is that the last bottle ended up being put up for immediate resale on ebay.

People aim to prevent committee members getting the bottles they want in order to line their own pockets - yet they contribute no service to anyone. They are just parasites.

This time, as last time, people will try to cheat the system to get more than their entitlement. This directly takes whisky away from people who might be entitled to it. You have our resident whisky tout upthread actually telling people in paint by numbers steps how to cheat. Classy. Now you are coming along exercising judgement of Solomon (quite badly, if I may say so) to decide which person you will assist in getting double helpings - at someone else's expense who will be left without a bottle at all. And if the bottle is really for I_Spey's friend, let I_Spey's friend buy it himself or herself.

It is people like you and I_Spey who spoil it for everyone. And if you look at other threads, you'll see that this Forum, which was once really pretty honorable, has taken a real plunge in recent months with touts swapping tips and people looking for sure fire profitable investment. To be honest, this Forum would be far, far better off without people like that.


You do realize that the secondary market for the Whirlie will be greater (not necessarily more profitable) than the Oogling? Why? Because people have been limited to one bottle each, it makes them less likely to consume it and more likely to hang on to it for possible re-sale.

A bigger run (less collectible) and allowing two bottles per order (more attractive to drink one/hold one) would be a sensible balance between curbing pure speculation purchasing and encouraging consumption of the product.

Parasites; cheating; entitlement; judgement et al, sensationalize much, Nick? Whatever happened to "you snooze you lose" commercialism that exists in every other limited/collectible market?

I think the forum would be far better off if you stopped getting your knickers in a twirl over a tiny percentage of people doing something that has marginal effect on you.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby parvus » Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:27 am

Nick, here's a quote from you back in June 2006 when the Oogling came out:
Nick Brown wrote:[...]But given that Ardbeg initially thought it looked OK to sell 1300 bottles at £30 a go, why should they fret about people who sell the stuff on? Ardbeg still has the money they set out to make.


So, if Ardbeg is making the money they set out to make, why are you fretting so much about the secondary market and any potential profit made there?
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Wave » Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:09 am

Why should I_Spey get two?


Because I_Spey ordered them, if he gets 2 then more power to him I say! If Ardbeg sends them to him then your beef is with ARDBEG, take it up with them.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:38 am

Let's be clear. Ardbeg has set the rule at one bottle per member. I_Spey tried to cheat by breaking that rule. In normal society, if you try to break a rule, you get punished. Yet here, we see poor, gullible SMK deciding to help him out. My point, which I hadn't thought was too difficult to grasp, was that we would all have liked more than the one bottle but chose to play by the rules. Yet the one person who tried to cheat seems to get all the sympathy and help. I, Les and SoI are NOT asking for second bottles, because we recognize that it would be unfair for us to do so. I was just pointing out that if you were going to bless someone with second helpings, it seems odd to bless the cheat. If SMK doesn't want a bottle, then he or she should leave it for someone who does want one and hasn't got one.

As for my quote a couple of years ago, I still half stand by it. That was Ardbeg complaining that people (who might have followed their sales rules) were selling their whisky on ebay. I think this is inevitable if you sell a product at under market value. But what I really find objectionable is people who try to cheat on the purchase rules to get more for themselves, and people who try to skew a market by shilling or organizing runs on selected shelves in a bid to drive up the value of their own stock. That's not economic principles of a free market - that's underhand practice.

Yes, I have used some emotive language. But that's because I think there is a real risk that a few people are using these pages for ends that are in direct conflict with the ethos of Whisky Magazine and the interests of most of its readers. And I am saddened that some members of this forum seem to side automatically with anyone who is being criticized without first asking whether the criticism might be correct.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:41 am

Wave wrote:
Why should I_Spey get two?


Because I_Spey ordered them, if he gets 2 then more power to him I say! If Ardbeg sends them to him then your beef is with ARDBEG, take it up with them.

Did you read the thread at all, or did you just post the first idea that popped into your head? You seem to have missed all the bit about SMK offering to "help".

And if Ardbeg were to turn a blind eye to an order for two bottles (which they won't), then my beef would be with both Ardbeg and I_Spey.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby fishboy » Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:03 am

adogranonthepitch wrote:Not me though ... why ... well its the thrill of the chase ... thats way too easy ... the hunting ... I like to cast my line and hunt the fishy ...... not sit there shooting fish in a barrell!

This opinion might not sit right with some ... so be it.


:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Poor little fishboy!!!!
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Leither » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:01 am

Nick Brown wrote:I think there is a real risk that a few people are using these pages for ends that are in direct conflict with the ethos of Whisky Magazine and the interests of most of its readers.


Hear here. I think Nick is right in the point he is getting at.

It could of course be that either the written word does not always get across the true meaning or that English is perhaps not the 1st language for some, but I also get the feeling that a small minority of folks are out for personal gain, for example 'buying a bottle for a friend' or to 'register many times'. The honest person would perhaps perceive this as dishonesty.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:08 am

In this particular instance (not generally), it's perhaps important to remember that the "Committee" is simply an Ardbeg marketing tool. No more, no less.

Anyone can become a "Committee" member at any time for nothing. No entry requirements. Zilch.

When I phoned up Ardbeg Distillery yesterday, I simply said that I'd heard/read about Corryvreckan and would like a bottle. The girl asked me if I'd received the mailshot and I said (honestly) not yet.

She didn't ask for my "Committee" login details (which I had ready to give her). Simply took my Maestro details and a mailing address.

The distillery's only interest is in selling 5,000 bottles. They're not interested in honour, morality, etc. Just making £225,000 extra gross sales inside a week.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby parvus » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am

Nick Brown wrote:Let's be clear. Ardbeg has set the rule at one bottle per member. I_Spey tried to cheat by breaking that rule. In normal society, if you try to break a rule, you get punished. Yet here, we see poor, gullible SMK deciding to help him out.


You took a facetious remark by SMK and ran with it because it gave you a bit of dramatic leverage to your argument.

My point, which I hadn't thought was too difficult to grasp, was that we would all have liked more than the one bottle but chose to play by the rules. Yet the one person who tried to cheat seems to get all the sympathy and help.


The only sympathy that person has gotten is the rightful backing of people who felt your comments were completely unjustified attacks on the person.

I, Les and SoI are NOT asking for second bottles, because we recognize that it would be unfair for us to do so.


But if you could have one, you would - it is obvious from your posting history that you're a collector, be it to sell or otherwise. Geese, gander, and whatnot.

I was just pointing out that if you were going to bless someone with second helpings, it seems odd to bless the cheat. If SMK doesn't want a bottle, then he or she should leave it for someone who does want one and hasn't got one.


As far as i'm aware, and I could be wrong, his remark was sarcastic at best.

As for my quote a couple of years ago, I still half stand by it. That was Ardbeg complaining that people (who might have followed their sales rules) were selling their whisky on ebay. I think this is inevitable if you sell a product at under market value.


The producer is ultimately in charge of market value - The guys who run Ardbeg are not daft bits of 3 day old tuna, they knew that any limited Ardbeg would fetch a good price on the secondary market. Short of Laphroaig kindly suggesting people don't sell their Feis Ile bottlings on ebay, i've never directly seen a distillery tell people not to sell things on the secondary market.

But what I really find objectionable is people who try to cheat on the purchase rules to get more for themselves, and people who try to skew a market by shilling or organizing runs on selected shelves in a bid to drive up the value of their own stock.


Speculation and delusion, nothing more.

Yes, I have used some emotive language. But that's because I think there is a real risk that a few people are using these pages for ends that are in direct conflict with the ethos of Whisky Magazine and the interests of most of its readers. And I am saddened that some members of this forum seem to side automatically with anyone who is being criticized without first asking whether the criticism might be correct.


Direct conflict with the ethos? This isn't the round table, Nick. As far as i'm aware the 'ethos' of this forum is to promote the discussion of all aspects of whisky, and that includes the terror that is market speculation.

I will argue that if it weren't for a small handful of speculators in the mix of regular customers, these bottlings wouldn't be as popular nor as common as they currently are.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby martin grant » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:31 am

Has anyone received their bottle yet?

I'm really looking forward to trying this one. Fingers crossed the postman brings it today.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Newbie » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:38 am

I think everyone is getting wound up over a misunderstanding here! I like to believe I Spey is genuinely ordering a bottle for his friend and just didn't read the description properly. There are other people who have ordered more than one by mistake /deliberately but no one is criticising them.

What has been said has been more than enough to get both points of view accross and we should just focus on the Ardbeg!

Having said that has anyone else recieved the Corryvreckan yet?
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Aidan » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:46 am

martin grant wrote:Has anyone received their bottle yet?

I'm really looking forward to trying this one. Fingers crossed the postman brings it today.


Nothing yet. Nor did I get the booklet.

Does anyone have any idea of the makeup of the whisky yet?
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Leither » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:52 am

Nope, nor me - I haven't received the committee mailshot from Ardbeg yet, let alone a bottle of the Corryvreckan.

But like others have said I'm really looking forward to it when it does, eventually, arrive.

I remember a couple of years ago the same thing happened with the Young Uigeadail (Oogling) - it was all gone before I got the mailing through so it's only thanks to this forum that I got the 'heads-up' on the Corryvreckan. :thumbsup:

I've reports/rumours of it being from Burgundy casks?
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby recordmeister » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:09 am

My bottle arrived today. It is awesome. Pictures here:

http://www.caskstrength.net

It comes with a couple of amazing bits. 1- the standard tag / booklet around the neck 2- a hand stamped, named, handwritten reciept. Awesome. Check out the pictures and review of the bottle. Sadly, no tasting notes as yet, but we'll get some up during Feis Ile.

RM
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:20 am

Thanks for the pictures. My 5...erm...I mean 1 bottle hasn't arrived yet, but hopefully today.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby recordmeister » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:27 am

Not a problem. It really is a beauty. You can not fault the Ardbeg branding and their bottles certainly take pride of place at the front of my cabinet. it's the little touches like the hand written, personalised receipt that really does it for me, as well as the consistancy of the artwork etc. My biggest problem is the "over-egging" of the historic stories, such as the one in the booklet that come with this bottle. Written like a cheesy fairy-tale, I find them a little cringe-worthy myself!

http://www.caskstrength.net
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:56 am

Presumably there is no box? Am I right?

I hate the flimsy boxes used by some distilleries. I love Bruichladdich's metal tubes and Glenmorangie's old tubes. But hate boxes. Too easily damaged.

From a global warming perspective though, external packaging's not needed. So ditch it. Mailing easier. Display easier.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby shoganai » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:56 am

recordmeister - Did it come with a box?

Either way, looks like a winner!! I wonder how many people will open it vs stash it away?
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby John McGill » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:04 pm

shoganai wrote:recordmeister - Did it come with a box?


According to the article:

"The bottle is the classic Ardbeg OB shape in dark green glass, with label on the front and back but no box."

Interestingly he ordered on the 11th and has his bottle. I ordered on the 9th and I'm still waiting :cry:
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby recordmeister » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:51 pm

Correct- there is NO box with this release. I have mixed feelings on boxes. Some are good (Lagavulin's are built like a small London flat!) and some are bad. I hate tubes of any kind. I don't mind bottles not having a box, but if I am going to pay £100+ for an OB, I'd quite like something extra thrown in for my money!! Make an effort at least!

http://www.caskstrength.net
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby LeoDLion » Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:04 pm

recordmeister wrote:Not a problem. It really is a beauty. You can not fault the Ardbeg branding and their bottles certainly take pride of place at the front of my cabinet. it's the little touches like the hand written, personalised receipt that really does it for me, as well as the consistancy of the artwork etc. My biggest problem is the "over-egging" of the historic stories, such as the one in the booklet that come with this bottle. Written like a cheesy fairy-tale, I find them a little cringe-worthy myself!

http://www.caskstrength.net

But there is no word on age? And it seems nobody has tasted it since I dont read any tasting notes yet.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby recordmeister » Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:21 pm

LeoDLion wrote:
recordmeister wrote:Not a problem. It really is a beauty. You can not fault the Ardbeg branding and their bottles certainly take pride of place at the front of my cabinet. it's the little touches like the hand written, personalised receipt that really does it for me, as well as the consistancy of the artwork etc. My biggest problem is the "over-egging" of the historic stories, such as the one in the booklet that come with this bottle. Written like a cheesy fairy-tale, I find them a little cringe-worthy myself!

http://www.caskstrength.net

But there is no word on age? And it seems nobody has tasted it since I dont read any tasting notes yet.


true, no age statement. but that doesn't bother me too much, if it is a good whisky, then it's a good whisky. The strength of it suggests that it is vatted at cask strength. To me that offsets the idea of giving an age statement. I'd rather have a NAS at 57ish% than an "aged" whisky at 40%... actually, I'd take either!

I'm not opening my bottle yet. As it says on the site, tasting notes will be posted after the Islay whisky festival at the end of May. :D

http://www.caskstrength.net
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby zippy » Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:31 pm

So it looks like a few people have got it delivered but nobody seems to have opened it yet to taste it? Surely not *all* of these bottles are being stashed away or put on ebay!! :roll:
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby recordmeister » Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:36 pm

There is nothing wrong with waiting to open a bottle of whisky! I waited about a year before opening my Ardbeg 1977 that I got in early 2007. If I was that desperate for a drink, I think I'd be worried... :wink:

At the moment, the 19 bottles I have open will do! Esp as I can wait to taste it at Feis Ile!!! Whoop!!

http://www.caskstrength.net
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby bamber » Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:42 pm

I will open my bottle as soon as I get it :)
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:35 pm

parvus wrote:
I, Les and SoI are NOT asking for second bottles, because we recognize that it would be unfair for us to do so.


But if you could have one, you would - it is obvious from your posting history that you're a collector, be it to sell or otherwise. Geese, gander, and whatnot.

Oh dear, Parvus. How little you know me. Almost every bottle I buy is bought with a view to drinking - sooner or later. I am a bit behind, but I'm certainly not a hoarder. Nor have I ever sold a bottle of whisky for more than I have paid for it myself. In fact, I can only think of one bottle I have sold - a duty free Laphroaig offering - to a fellow forum member for face value. And if I had the opportunity to get a second bottle of Corryvreckan when other people would not have that opportunity, I would decline. That's because I have a conscience.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Single Malt Kommunist » Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:36 pm

Rules, as some have pointed out, are important. So lets all follow the Ardbeg Committee Rules:

(Section 2, §6)
Moreover, members are expected to actively pursue a serious and altruistic duty: to bring others into the Ardbeg fold. The result of the collective effect of this is to increase worldwide consumption, thereby ensuring that the doors of Ardbeg Distillery shall never close again.

Either through fair play, or by hook or crook, I_Spey has actively pursued the serious and altruistic duty of bringing others into the Ardbeg fold. Well done I_Spey (pins a used Ardbeg cork ribbon on I_Spey's lapel)

As others have previously pointed out, the collective effect of this will increase worldwide consumption of Ardbeg, and ensure maximum profits for the private holders of Glenmorangie, plc.

Its all there in black and green.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby adogranonthepitch » Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:47 pm

I had heard the ship carrying the orders from the Distillery sailed too close to the Whirlpool and three quarters of the consignment got tipped over board and was swallowed into the Curlywirly
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby vitara7 » Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:50 pm

Nick Brown wrote:
parvus wrote:
I, Les and SoI are NOT asking for second bottles, because we recognize that it would be unfair for us to do so.


But if you could have one, you would - it is obvious from your posting history that you're a collector, be it to sell or otherwise. Geese, gander, and whatnot.

Oh dear, Parvus. How little you know me. Almost every bottle I buy is bought with a view to drinking - sooner or later. I am a bit behind, but I'm certainly not a hoarder. Nor have I ever sold a bottle of whisky for more than I have paid for it myself. In fact, I can only think of one bottle I have sold - a duty free Laphroaig offering - to a fellow forum member for face value. And if I had the opportunity to get a second bottle of Corryvreckan when other people would not have that opportunity, I would decline. That's because I have a conscience.



ill second that, as it was me he sold it too. and he only charged me what it was going for at the duty free, even at the time if he wanted to he could have shoved it on ebay and got a lot more for it. and when he says hes a bit behind in drinking his bottles, he right about that allright :wink:
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby les taylor » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:02 pm

Hi V7 nice to see you again. :)
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Single Malt Kommunist » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:23 pm

adogranonthepitch wrote:I had heard the ship carrying the orders from the Distillery sailed too close to the Whirlpool and three quarters of the consignment got tipped over board and was swallowed into the Curlywirly


Dog, I wager you are donning your dive gear at the moment.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:26 pm

Three quarters of the bottles lost at sea. Excellent news. So, now a limited edition of 1,250. E-Bay awaits.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby adogranonthepitch » Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:43 pm

OK .. boys ... I'm going into the Whirlpool to get the bottles ....

Image

There will of course be a premuim for said bottles .....
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby TroyM » Wed Apr 16, 2008 2:03 am

I got an email from the Ardbeg shop and they said that because of the glut of orders, it could take 2 weeks to process them all.
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Re: Ardbeg Corryvreckan?

Postby parvus » Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:12 am

Nick Brown wrote:Oh dear, Parvus. How little you know me.


I know enough. On one hand you lambaste people who take part in secondary market selling, and on the other you're quite happy to purchase from them. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

Almost every bottle I buy is bought with a view to drinking - sooner or later. I am a bit behind, but I'm certainly not a hoarder. Nor have I ever sold a bottle of whisky for more than I have paid for it myself. In fact, I can only think of one bottle I have sold - a duty free Laphroaig offering - to a fellow forum member for face value. And if I had the opportunity to get a second bottle of Corryvreckan when other people would not have that opportunity, I would decline. That's because I have a conscience.


I didn't know that Laphroaig did a 'High horse' bottling.
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