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Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby les taylor » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:30 am

eelbrook wrote:I'm a naughty boy! I'll consider myself duly spanked with bamboo soaked in Laphroaig.



eelbrook you are duly punished. It made me laugh though. Do you know who else is laughing? Jim Murray you bought his book. Will you buy one next year?


:)
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Fri Oct 19, 2007 3:46 pm

Don't get me wrong. Jim's got real talent. I loved his whisky tasting in Stourbridge. And some of what he's written is top notch.

But I do think that he's got a somewhat 'over-inflated' ego, in marked contrast perhaps to the modesty of Michael Jackson (sadly missed).

I'm guessing that many of those that Bible know enough about the subject to have formed their own opinions and tastes. I can't imagine them buying/not buying a malt just because of Jim's scores.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Leither » Fri Oct 19, 2007 4:59 pm

Yip, it's all opinion and tasting is very much subjective according to one's own palate.

Personally I can relate to his dislike of sulphured cask influence so the Bible helps me avoid such examples. I also can now appreciate the influence of a 'good' or 'clean' sherry cask from examples he uses.

He does go into detail in his intro this year but I think he's right - it's all about helping the industry improve and ultimately helping the consumer. There is an increasingly wide choice of whiskies and prices are going up all the time so the Bible helps me to avoid the duds.

Apparently some markets (perhaps German palates?) seem to like such 'sulphured' or 'meaty' notes but I don't.

Anyway, in a nutshell I value his opinion and knowledge and I'm prepared to pay half the price of a standard bottle of malt for that.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Iain » Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:35 pm

Jim Murray rates the current Laphroaig-soaked bamboo spankings as a 96. He is particularly disparaging about the Chivas Regal-soaked canes (rated only 76), which he complains are ruined by an over-dose of caramel which blunts the characteristic sharpness of the Chivas canes he remembers fondly from the days when he first discovered whisky spankings back in the 1970s.

However, he has recently begun blending his own Scotch whiskies specially formulated for spanking canes, and he modestly asserts they are better than any others on the market. He awards them a score of 98. Let us know what you think of them, Eelbrook :thumbsup:
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:55 am

This ain't funny. When i was 8 i was incarcerated in a boarding school with a headmaster who would cane you for anything...like coming 2nd in the exams!

"How come you came second..." he boomed in front of the whole school,"When your results have been so poor all term? (Duh, because i got my head down and WORKED you creep...) you must have been lazy the rest of the term! I'm going to beat you for being lazy the rest of the term."

Yes, folks, I had that for 5 years of my young life...and his breath, pre-beating, ALWAYS stank of freshly drunk cheap whisky. It was part of his ritual.

Wanker!

With that i shall end the night in honour of Jim, a better breed of whisky headmaster, with my last dram of Jim-sez-sell-your- granny-to-get-a-bottle, Serendipity!
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Aidan » Sat Oct 20, 2007 7:40 am

Yes, he awards the Knappogue Castles very high markes, which I would not say they are worthy of. That's because he was involved in the blending.

I think the people in the industry have a little more experience putting whiskies together.

And he says that he is the definitive voice of whisky, and says that Michael Jackson is the equivalent in beer. But I'd argue that Michael Jackson was the definitive voice of both whisky and beer.

That all said, I still like Murray.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:32 pm

I went to a grammar school for a while. Each term, we were given a class position for our term's work. Also, a separate class position for the end of term exam.

One term, up came the end of term subject by subject review with the Headmaster (in front of the whole class and my form tutor).

Conversation turned to History. The Head asked why my term position was 30th, but my exam position was 1st. I innocently responded that I could 'pull my finger out' when it mattered.

Off he went to soak a particularly thick bamboo cane in some rather cheap supermarket blend.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:37 pm

Nothing like a bit of encouragement , eh?

Ah well. an original use for a cheap blend I suppose...
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:48 pm

Back on topic, one evidently should not take the Bible as Gospel Truth!

It does seem Jim has a few axes to grind, and God has obviously appeared to Man in the form of Ardbeg...but sulphur and caramel notwithstanding, it's still a great read, and has pointed me to many great whiskies.

I suppose it's all part of the learning curve as a whisky devotee to make up one's own mind. I enjoyed Serendipity, a high 90s dram according to Jim,but, interestingly, followed mine last night with a touch of Caol ila 18, which I rather preferred, despite it being a low 80s dram according to Jim.

I once emailed him about a single cask Bowmore my father in law gave me 2 Christmasses ago - easily the best, most interesting Bowmore i've ever tasted. He neither replied nor reviewed it, so there!

I'm sure I'll be getting the new edition. The plusses outweigh the minusses for me.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:45 pm

Jim Murray never comes to Milton Keynes, even though he lives 'up the road' in Wellingborough. He claims it's his way of protesting against the City having 'stolen' a football club.

NB Milton Keynes Dons today won their 8th league match in a row and are top of Coca Cola 2. Premier League - we're coming. Complete with one of the best grounds in Britain
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby les taylor » Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:40 am

I have my copy with my personal message from Jim. I shall get to grips with it over the next few weeks.

eelbrook the Mk Dons are doing well. Hope they continue to do so.

:)
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby adogranonthepitch » Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:56 pm

I have had the pleasure of meeting Jim at as Whisky tasting Lab and spending nearly two hours with him as he does his stuff.

yes its one mans opinion, but its a valid opinion.

.. just as much as the next mans!

Remember, its only fermented barley juice boys!
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:33 pm

Having spent some time with the Bible 2008 today, I've one further criticism - perhaps not of Jim but of the editors/publishers.

Clearly, Jim hasn't the time to re-taste each whisky sampled in previous years. So, some entries are vertabum copied of those in Bible 2007. Fair enough. Except that obvious updating should be done. It's a bit amateurish issuing a publication in October 2007 advising that a whisky's say likely to be released in the future in Summer 2006.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Di Blasi » Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:40 pm

eelbrook wrote:Having spent some time with the Bible 2008 today, I've one further criticism - perhaps not of Jim but of the editors/publishers.

Clearly, Jim hasn't the time to re-taste each whisky sampled in previous years. So, some entries are vertabum copied of those in Bible 2007. Fair enough. Except that obvious updating should be done. It's a bit amateurish issuing a publication in October 2007 advising that a whisky's say likely to be released in the future in Summer 2006.


Great point eelbrook, I too have found a few editing issues as you mention, and also feel they should be corrected.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby jcasazza » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:20 am

Maybe he could run it like my Looseleaf law books. They vome in a binder, 3 ring style, you buy the books then you subscribe to say quarterly updates, then they just reprint the pages for the new drams sampled and you insert them in to your book, and remove the old ones.

Works for my Law books and my flying stuff.......
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby K-Mile » Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:43 am

jcasazza wrote:Maybe he could run it like my Looseleaf law books. They vome in a binder, 3 ring style, you buy the books then you subscribe to say quarterly updates, then they just reprint the pages for the new drams sampled and you insert them in to your book, and remove the old ones.

Works for my Law books and my flying stuff.......


That would be great for the customer, but they have to do their release cycle all year long, instead of once a year. This would mean continuous work for the publisher.

And, by publishing a book each year, you also pay for the whiskies you already know from last year, without Jim or the publisher having to do much for it.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:56 am

Eelbrook wrote:"Clearly, Jim hasn't the time to re-taste each whisky sampled in previous years. So, some entries are vertabum copied of those in Bible 2007. Fair enough. Except that obvious updating should be done. It's a bit amateurish issuing a publication in October 2007 advising that a whisky's say likely to be released in the future in Summer 2006."

Imagine! Haven't seen the 2008 version, but he must be approaching 4K whiskies...if he retasted them all, that's...well over 35 whiskies a day he'd be tasting...every day of the year!(And don't tell me he wouldn't swallow a good few!)

In which case I'd say he deserves every penny he gets...for a liver transplant!

It's a hard life, eh?
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:15 pm

I think that Jim Sampled about 800 for this version of the Bible. A sod of a way to make a living lol. Give me my dull desk job anyday
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:32 pm

Reggaeblues - I hope your music's better than your maths :)

I mlistened to Mark Gillespie's whisky broadcast which included a chat with JM. JM mentioned in relation to Michael Jackson that the life of a whisky taster, although not without its compensations, does mean making considerable sacrifices. This includes being constantly on the road. I suspect you can also add financial insecurity to the list. Obviously, even with spittoons, getting through 800 whiskies in 6 months is a bit of an ordeal - especially when many of them, by definition, are going to be rather ordinary. That's over 4 a day, every day. And presumably some days are written off due to hosting tastings, being otherwise on the road, or drinking drams for other purposes.

Fair play to you JM - and the personal message was really very impressive indeed (it said "how I envy you breating in the beautiful North British air every day"), because where I live in Edinburgh, if the wind blows the right way, I get the sweet smell of the North British distillery straight through to my sitting room.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:16 pm

Nick

Where abouts in Edinburgh are you?

My father-in-law stays in Chesser, which isn't that far from North British (which if memory serves me is behind Heart's ground).
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Wed Oct 24, 2007 9:16 pm

"Six Isles" doesn't seem to get a mention in the Vatted Malts section. Strange. Has it been discontinued?
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby les taylor » Wed Oct 24, 2007 9:33 pm

Guy's check out page 203 Tullibardine. Read Jim's view of the 1966 world cup expression. Priceless. 8)
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Wed Oct 24, 2007 11:31 pm

Nick wrote "Reggaeblues - I hope your music's better than your maths"

It is! It Is! ask Les!!

I'm sorry! I got 8% and a thrashing in my pre common entrance Algebra exam. a hopeless case...

that's why i took up music. i'd never be an accountant. the only figures that mean anything to me are female...or the ABV numbers on a bottle of malt, and then preferably between 46 and 58%...
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby les taylor » Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:51 am

I've never seen RB does Maths. However I'd go to see him play again. By the way RB when are you this way again?

:)
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:45 pm

I can count to four, usually at the start of a song.

when it comes to dramming , i lose count after about three...

Les, the nearest I am to you is the Globe, windmill road , Brentford, Nr. chiswick, on November the 30th. not exactly your neighborhood, probably a 45 min. trip...but it's a cracking gig! A real music audience...and a fair malt selection: Aberlour 10. bowmore 12, Dalwhinnie, HP 12, |Laphroiag, Balvenie...good standard malts!
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:15 pm

I might be just being thick, but I can't spot any of the Classic Malts Distiller's Editions in the Bible. Must be me.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby les taylor » Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:21 pm

eelbrook wrote:I might be just being thick, but I can't spot any of the Classic Malts Distiller's Editions in the Bible. Must be me.


But did you get your whisky tasting map from the Classic Malts and a nice little letter from Dave Broom, in the post today. Very nice. 8)
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby pmullin » Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:53 pm

eelbrook wrote:I might be just being thick, but I can't spot any of the Classic Malts Distiller's Editions in the Bible. Must be me.


Noticed the same thing... I was curious to see how he rated the Talisker DE (1992/2005), but alas, it was not to be found.

However, I must say that I am very impressed with the number of additions since the 2007 edition.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Sat Oct 27, 2007 12:52 am

Les: "But did you get your whisky tasting map from the Classic Malts and a nice little letter from Dave Broom, in the post today. Very nice."

Where's mine???

Not that I need a damn tasting map. I know the way to my whisky table, thanks v. much!(providing I ain't had one too many)and I'm headed that way now for another drop of "Almost There".

...Which ought to please Jim.

Strange. No DEs to be found in he latest Bible, you say. Ah well, prejudice maybe. I don't remember his marking 'em as high as the "natural" versions anyway, whereas MJ rated the Lagavulin versions equal, and the Taliskers also as I recall...
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby K-Mile » Sat Oct 27, 2007 1:11 am

Reggaeblues wrote:Strange. No DEs to be found in he latest Bible, you say. Ah well, prejudice maybe. I don't remember his marking 'em as high as the "natural" versions anyway, whereas MJ rated the Lagavulin versions equal, and the Taliskers also as I recall...


That's right, almost every DE I could find in The Companion was rated as high as the standard expression. Only the Glenkinchie DE was rated just a little bit higher...
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Sat Oct 27, 2007 12:58 pm

At Luton Airport the other day, I whipped out the Bible to check on "Six Isles", but that didn't appear to be in there either. Odd, cos I'm sure that it was in last year.

Also, I don't think that the last two or three OB " Port Ellen releases are reviewed.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby corbuso » Wed Nov 07, 2007 4:51 pm

eelbrook wrote:Having spent some time with the Bible 2008 today, I've one further criticism - (..) Except that obvious updating should be done. It's a bit amateurish issuing a publication in October 2007 advising that a whisky's say likely to be released in the future in Summer 2006.

I have been trough the book and I do agree with you that it is sometimes quite amateurish with the obvious updating not done. For the Ardbeg 2006 it is mentioned to be released by mid-July 2006, and this was coming from the 2005 edition. In 3 years, It could have been updated. Same thing with the Brora 30 YO annual release when you read that one is probably the best whisky of this year and then you read in the next bottling that it was better than the previous one. And if the work was well done, you should not find a Bunna listed in the Bruichladdich section. For me, Jim and his publishing companies don't take the time to deliver a proper book and seem to be more concerned about selling quickly as many books as possible.
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby MrIntrepid » Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:09 pm

My bible sits next to the loo, it is an ideal quick read for that purpose (sorry to lower the tone :D ) . I enjoy JM's bible, however I can't believe the number of spelling and grammatical errors in the text which would be reduced by a simple spell check or an edit, I counted about 5 on the first two pages, most books would never get published in such a state. I am sure he could find a few proofreaders on this forum who would be happy to help in exchange for a nice bottle from his collection :wink:
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Reggaeblues » Wed Nov 07, 2007 7:54 pm

MY bible usually sits next to the loo also. Is it just we English who like to read whilst "on the throne?"

Maybe JM does his own proofreading, in which case, you'd expect a lot of errors given the nature of his "day job!"
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Re: Whisky Bible 2008 - Jim Murray

Postby Deactivated Member » Wed Nov 07, 2007 9:37 pm

The Bible has its place, but I'm becoming ever disillusioned with it. It's out-of-date at publication, there are noteworthy omissions, and there's not nearly enough care paid to the text. Needs to do better.

MaltWhiskyYearbook 2008, by contrast, is fabulous. Up-to-the-moment, great photos and narrative, and fab articles.
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