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Is the Laphroaig 10 Cs artificially coloured?

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Is the Laphroaig 10 Cs artificially coloured?

Postby Macallovich » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:53 pm

Comparing with Lagavulin 12 Cs and Ardbeg Ten, Laphroaig 10 Cs has a full gold colour. E150? :roll:
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Postby Choochoo » Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:17 pm

It is. The link below has a list of coloured malts. :cry:

http://www.whiskymag.com/forum/viewtopi ... c&start=15
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Postby kallaskander » Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:40 pm

Hi there,

as Germany to my knowledge is the only country in the world where the use of artificial colouring must be stated on the package and labels of the bottles I had a look. There is no mentioning of articicial colour or caramel/E 150.
So until further contradictory notice let´s asume that it is not artifically coloured.

Greetings
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Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:18 pm

Choochoo wrote:It is. The link below has a list of coloured malts. :cry:

http://www.whiskymag.com/forum/viewtopi ... c&start=15


Interesting to see some of the whiskies that do have colour added - includes the DL Ardbeg 25yo 1975 -Jim Murray's best ever Scotch. Also Ardbeg Provenance, held by many to be the greatest. All the Highland Parks. The Glenglassaughs. In fact, one begins to wonder whether it matters at all.
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Postby Deactivated Member » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:29 pm

I'll bet much of the time it doesn't, as very little is used. But it's the not knowing that is bothersome.
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Postby bamber » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:44 pm

Nick Brown wrote:
Choochoo wrote:It is. The link below has a list of coloured malts. :cry:

http://www.whiskymag.com/forum/viewtopi ... c&start=15


Interesting to see some of the whiskies that do have colour added - includes the DL Ardbeg 25yo 1975 -Jim Murray's best ever Scotch. Also Ardbeg Provenance, held by many to be the greatest. All the Highland Parks. The Glenglassaughs. In fact, one begins to wonder whether it matters at all.


Nice link (I've posted this before):
http://www.maltmadness.com/mm17.html#17-01

Maybe it made those malts better ! However, I think we'd rather have no colouring.
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Postby Mr Ellen » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:46 pm

kallaskander wrote:Hi there,

as Germany to my knowledge is the only country in the world where the use of artificial colouring must be stated on the package and labels of the bottles I had a look. There is no mentioning of articicial colour or caramel/E 150.
So until further contradictory notice let´s asume that it is not artifically coloured.

Greetings
kallaskander


Denmark is the second country which also has to state whether there has been an additive to the whisky or not.
However, this will only be stated on the bottle if your bottle was intended for the german (or danish market). If you have an imported bottle or bought it from a foreign onlineshop it will not be stated.
Most mass marketed whiskies are coloured with E150 to be consistent in colour and the amounts used are often negligible...under 0.01% of the total.

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Postby Jan » Tue Mar 28, 2006 8:05 pm

Well, an important reason for disliking the practice of artificial colouring, is not being able to tell (or guess) anything about the whisky from the colour; Bourbon/sherry cask, age, 1st fill/refill etc.

/Jan
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Tue Mar 28, 2006 8:21 pm

Jan wrote:Well, an important reason for disliking the practice of artificial colouring, is not being able to tell (or guess) anything about the whisky from the colour; Bourbon/sherry cask, age, 1st fill/refill etc.

/Jan


I don't know if that is correct reasoning...

I would of imagined that say for instance if a sherry cask is viewed it would be of a certian colour. Then they blend and maybe add water. By adding water it dilutes the colour also. Therefore they wwould have taken the earlier cask strength sample and use that as their fixed colour for all. Not very nice but at the same time it does not overly worry me as as said earlier the colour aditive is miniscule.

We as mad whisky fanatics we prefer it pure but imagine if your coke was a different colour every time you went to buy it... it would make you think about the quality... well that is how the rest of the world sees it unfortunately so the masses get the consistency that they demand.
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Postby Mr Ellen » Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:38 pm

Jan wrote:Well, an important reason for disliking the practice of artificial colouring, is not being able to tell (or guess) anything about the whisky from the colour; Bourbon/sherry cask, age, 1st fill/refill etc.

/Jan


When it comes to the mass marketed whiskies, how could you possibly be told something from the barrel when at least a couple of thousands of them are being vatted together for consistancy? :?

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Postby Macallovich » Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:52 pm

I think HP 18 and HP25 are not artificially coloured (The HP triple pack says in the 18 and 25: natrural colour, not in the 12).
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Postby Simplicio » Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:42 am

I have a bottle of the Laphroaig CS which has on the back "mit Farbstoff" (with colour).
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Postby Virginia Gentleman » Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:54 am

kallaskander wrote:Hi there,

as Germany to my knowledge is the only country in the world where the use of artificial colouring must be stated on the package and labels of the bottles I had a look. There is no mentioning of articicial colour or caramel/E 150.
So until further contradictory notice let´s asume that it is not artifically coloured.

Greetings
kallaskander


I wish the rest of the world would adopt this practice.
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Postby kallaskander » Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:03 am

Hi there,

yes Virginia Gentleman or the producers just stop colouring single malts. AFAIK straight bourbon is not allowed to be artificially coloured by law (?)

Some distilleries like Springbank and Bruichladdich (the ones I am sure about) do not chill-filter or colour and fill the bottles at 46%.
More independent bottlers seem to follow suit than distilleries do, I`d say.

Greetings
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Postby hpulley » Wed Mar 29, 2006 1:34 pm

Independent bottlers led the way with unchillfiltering and no colouring. For them, there is no need for consistency! It is only the distiller who is trying to keep a constant product profile year after year that colouring is needed but I think they take it farther than that, often even colouring one-off bottlings to keep it within the distillery profile they have in mind.

Bruichladdich only started bottling at 46% UCF non-coloured once they were bought by a consortium led by IB Murray & McDavid.

Unless absolutely necessary, I don't buy 40-43% chill filtered, coloured slop or 'limited' bottlings of 10000 or even 100000 bottles. Cask strength, unchillfiltered and natural colour is my preference though I'll settle for less if I'm after a rare one and it is only available, for example, as a Connoiseur's Choice bottling. I'll definitely pay more, a lot more, for a whisky which is presented properly; e.g. I gladly pay double the price for a Duncan Taylor Glengarioch at cask strength compared to one bottled at 43%, chill filtered and coloured by Suntory/Morrison Bowmore. The OB is good but the DTC is a stunner and I suspect the raw whisky in the OB could have been, if it was presented correctly for the whisky afficianado.

Harry
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Postby kallaskander » Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:08 pm

Hi there,

sound policy Harry. I agree with you. Some distilleries seem to begin to see the light and issue non chill-filtered non coloured malts at 46%.
Clynelish 14, Laphroaig QC (as far as we know) Ardbeg. The thing about Bruichladdich is true say against Jim what you will here he is exemplary and very clear.

Greetings
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Postby ScotchBlog » Sat Apr 08, 2006 4:15 am

kallaskander wrote:or the producers just stop colouring single malts.

I've been told, and I may have said it in a different forum thread, that spirit caramel does more than colour the whisky, it acts as a binding agent and can mask blends that are not up to snuff...so it's unlikely that everyone will move away from colouring - it helps mask vatting inconsistencies.
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Postby Mr Fjeld » Sat Apr 08, 2006 9:43 am

I wholeheartedly agree with those who say colouring (and chill-filtering) should be abolished! Having said though I also recognise the fact that the Laphroaig 10 Cask Strength is one of the best whiskies I've had - coloured it may be - and there is a permanent room for it in my cabinet.

Christian
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Postby kallaskander » Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:16 am

Hi there,

if you were ready to accept that blends bought over the years change their shades of colour as they come there would be no need for colouring. It is in the nature of the blend with all the 50 odd whiskies in it that the colour changes from batch to batch.
For the blender there might well be the need to colour his product. At least if he cares for a recognisable brand. I think they all do.

Greetings
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:51 am

Mr Fjeld wrote:I wholeheartedly agree with those who say colouring (and chill-filtering) should be abolished! Having said though I also recognise the fact that the Laphroaig 10 Cask Strength is one of the best whiskies I've had - coloured it may be - and there is a permanent room for it in my cabinet.

Christian



I would love to see this too but unfortunately this is only purist talk and I think sometimes we loose sight of the fact that we are but a small minority of Whisky drinkers. Whiskey is produced for the masses and consistency is key to selling a product therefore the nessessary evil of caramel is with us for some time yet I reckon.
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Postby hpulley » Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:17 pm

irishwhiskeychaser wrote:
Mr Fjeld wrote:I wholeheartedly agree with those who say colouring (and chill-filtering) should be abolished! Having said though I also recognise the fact that the Laphroaig 10 Cask Strength is one of the best whiskies I've had - coloured it may be - and there is a permanent room for it in my cabinet.

Christian



I would love to see this too but unfortunately this is only purist talk and I think sometimes we loose sight of the fact that we are but a small minority of Whisky drinkers. Whiskey is produced for the masses and consistency is key to selling a product therefore the nessessary evil of caramel is with us for some time yet I reckon.


I disagree. I don't think cask strength whisky or single cask whisky are for the masses. Heck, even single malt sales in either volume or value is very small compared to blends. Whisky connoisseurs ARE the market for cask strength offerings and if we demand quality products then they'll give them to us. They key, however, is to vote with your wallet. If you buy it the way they offer it to you, they'll keep on offering it that way. You must decide for yourself what to buy but don't kid yourself that there is a huge market for cask strength whisky -- it's a drop in the bucket compared to 40% blends.

Harry
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:20 pm

hpulley wrote:
I disagree. I don't think cask strength whisky or single cask whisky are for the masses. Heck, even single malt sales in either volume or value is very small compared to blends. Whisky connoisseurs ARE the market for cask strength offerings and if we demand quality products then they'll give them to us. They key, however, is to vote with your wallet. If you buy it the way they offer it to you, they'll keep on offering it that way. You must decide for yourself what to buy but don't kid yourself that there is a huge market for cask strength whisky -- it's a drop in the bucket compared to 40% blends.

Harry


We will have to agree to disagree so .... :lol:

I can't really see that happening in the first place and we are kidding ourselves if we think that the connoisseur is the main market for CS whiskies. The connoiseur may buy the majority of very small batch whiskies but if they didn't it would be easily absorbed by Joe public. I have seen more people than not buying expensive whisky and not exactly know what they are buying. For every connoisseur (I prefer afficionado :wink: ) there are thousands of regular whisky drinkers that are happy to buy an expensive bottle for the prestige or any single malt because the packaging is cool or just to treat themselves. And another thing Laphroaig 10 Cask Strength is not a connoiseurs whisky it for every man who wants to drink it and they do. Joe public actually likes whisky and he also drinks malt the odd time too. If he like his glenfiddich there is no reason why he would not spend 100 on a cs glenfiddich once in the blue moon.

Don't get me wrong I'd like to think that we could influence the distilleries but I'm reckon that we can't. The smaller more independant ones do listen but the bigger companies ... you can forget it...

Sorry to be a pessimist but that I think is how it works. If I'm wrong then fair play, I'm not looking for a fight :wink: .
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Postby hpulley » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:52 pm

With Lagavulin 12yo CS telling drinkers to add 2 parts water to one part whisky (one assumes instead of equal parts as they would normally use), perhaps you are right in some places but over here I think only whisky afficianados would buy cask strength in the first place. The rest will add ice.

Harry
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Mon Apr 10, 2006 5:45 pm

hpulley wrote:With Lagavulin 12yo CS telling drinkers to add 2 parts water to one part whisky (one assumes instead of equal parts as they would normally use), perhaps you are right in some places but over here I think only whisky afficianados would buy cask strength in the first place. The rest will add ice.

Harry



I suppose you have a point there Harry... I'm comming from an Irish/UK prespective and see a lot of blank stares on people when they are mulling over the multitude of choice and even when they ask questions the person selling (unless it is one of the better chains or specialists) usually has about as much info as they can read from the back of the bottle :roll: but they still buy blind. I could nearly put myself in that catagory in regards to Scotch but at least with the help of the likes of you and the rest of the esteemed posters on this forum I can make semi-educated choices when choosing a new bottle. I suppose where I differ from you is I see Single malts and blends in te same light. All there to be tried & enjoyed equally, I reckon I get this attitude from starting from the Irish perspective where the blend is king.


regards Adrian
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Postby Mr Fjeld » Tue Apr 11, 2006 11:42 am

While I'm only speculating - and I think IWC has a point when he's saying the big companies do whatever suits them anyway - but I still think we'll see more cask strength varieties of the standard 40%'s. There will also probably be more non-chillfiltered and non-coloured whiskies available in general. Maybe I'm too naive but the trends today moving towards natural food and slow food, enthusiasts embracing the kitchen like never before demanding good ingredients stating local origins and all the local food and agriculture fairs etc - I think it's safe to say that something is happening. It has happened already with beer and wine where there all of a sudden are lots of micro breweries and winemakers catering for new and exciting market niches - segments none of the big companies believed in. Now you see even the big companies involving themselves in such markets because up to a certain point you won't make more money just by producing more. Profits are hurt and they discover a new market they can exploit. It's a bright future and I wouldn't be surprised if even the large companies lend an ear to the consumers. And consumers today are more quality oriented than before. I think we'll se more of it!

Phew - sorry for the long post :oops:

Christian
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Postby Elliot » Tue Apr 11, 2006 1:36 pm

kallaskander wrote:Hi there,

yes Virginia Gentleman or the producers just stop colouring single malts. AFAIK straight bourbon is not allowed to be artificially coloured by law (?)



Yes, you are exactly right. Nothing may be added to bourbon once it comes out of the barrel other than pure water.
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Postby Deactivated Member » Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:49 am

Christian, you make a good point, but there's still an awful lot of Big Macs and Budweiser sold.
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