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bruichladdich - one step too far?

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is bruichladdich now taking the mick?

yes
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43%
no
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Total votes : 23

bruichladdich - one step too far?

Postby vitara7 » Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:22 pm

just been on the bruichladdich web site, there proclaming that this new cltic nation whisky they have released, strictly limited edition of 7200 bottles, which is a mix of bruichladdich and irish to be whisky

clearly as it contains somthing other than 100% scottish whisky, then it is no longer whisky, but whiskey
is this another case of them just pleaseing themselfs as they go along? now werent bruchladdich one of the distilleries that was up in arms about the pure malt vatted malt debate over cardhu whisky? saying there needs to be standardisation in the terms.
it seems to be one rule for bruichladdich and one for everyone else.

im off my soapbox now...
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Postby lambda » Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:32 pm

Well, canadian is also called 'whisky' I think, at least sometimes. So you cannot really conclude that if it's not 100% scottish, it should be called 'whiskey'.
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Sun Dec 03, 2006 4:36 pm

Bruichladdich are actually doing nothing wrong here.

The major importance is not on the spelling of the word whisk(e)y but the usage of the word scotch. They cannot call this product Scotch Whisky. Further it has already been done by Jon, Mark & Robbo with the smooth sweet one.

You see the Scotch Whisky Association have gone to extreme lengths to protect the use of 'scotch' as a scottish product rather than the word whisky. If any other nation eludes to this on their labels then the SWA comes in fighting (and with good cause too). They have even pulled up some distilleries in other countries from using terms such as 'Glen' as these countries historically or geographically could not attest to the claim of the name.

Further historically certian olden time Irish distillers had used Whisky as the spelling of their product also but this has totally died out.

Check out this site in relation to Dunvilles Irish Whisky.

http://www.classicwhiskey.com/flash/dunvilles_intro.htm


An Irish distillery could easily open in the morning and call their product Whisky but not Scotch whisky.
Last edited by irishwhiskeychaser on Sun Dec 03, 2006 5:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby The Fachan » Sun Dec 03, 2006 4:54 pm

IWC,

Maybe I have missed it but there is no mention of Scotch on the labelling of the bottle, at least not the image on the web-site. So techinically there is no problem.
This the same principal as Compass box did earlier in the year, maybe doesn't sit weill with some ( myself included) but its technically correct..

Ian

Had a quick re-think about this and no reason for me to get upset with Mark and the team. Its smar thinking and innovation, it was just me being narrow minded.
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Postby irishwhiskeychaser » Sun Dec 03, 2006 5:04 pm

Just re read my first post and have amended....

I meant to say Bruchladdich are doing NOTHING wrong here ..... oooppppss sorry for the typo :oops:

So I'm in agreement with you.
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Postby Lawrence » Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:43 pm

The Celtic nations bottlings are a new program for the distillery and next year they will vatt with Glen Breton from Canada, each year they will add a new Celtic nation to the list, it's an unusual idea but not for me. However I see nothing wrong with it and many people around the world are eargerly awaiting the arrival of the first release. I should say that I have not yet tasted it amd may change my mind if it's really tasty.

I also have to add that from my perspective of having access to so few whsikies in my home market I'm used to see all sorts of bottles that I cannot get my hands on to try. I have a hard time understanding why people complain about wide choice, it does you no harm after all, you're not forced to buy all their bottlings. But I like wide choice.
Last edited by Lawrence on Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Deactivated Member » Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:47 pm

In concept, I've not a problem with 'vatting' whisk(e)ys from different countries. It did work well the the JMR "Smoother Sweeter One".

But do we need yet another Bruichladdich gimmick bottling.

If the whisky's good enough, surely it will sell without being constantly 'gift wrapped'.
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Postby Lawrence » Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:18 pm

Just a quick flip through the 2006 Whisky Bible to see the following Official Bottlings from each distillery;

Aberlour 17
Ardbeg 28
Glenlivet 21
Bowmore 15
Glenfiddich 22
Balvenie 16
Glenfarclas 33
Springbank 20
Macallan 77!

Hmmm, no complaints about their number of OB's but Bruichladdich's 21 OB's are Over The Top!
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Postby vitara7 » Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:32 pm

yeh but lawrance, those bottings lsited in the book are those not in total? most of those youll struggle to find in shops etc these days and many are from years back. remember bruichladdich has only been on the go in its current form for a few years, and all those bottles are freely avalable from them, making them not really that limited at all...
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Postby Aidan » Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:54 pm

Whisky made in the old midleton distillery in Ireland was called whisky too, rather than whisky. And Makers Mark (I think) calls its product whisky.
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Postby Mustardhead » Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:54 pm

Lawrence wrote:Just a quick flip through the 2006 Whisky Bible to see the following Official Bottlings from each distillery;

<snip>
Macallan 77!

Hmmm, no complaints about their number of OB's but Bruichladdich's 21 OB's are Over The Top!


I suspect that most Macallan drinkers take exception to Macallan's bottling policy. The 12yo sherry and FO are designed for foreign markets and those markets can't have the 10yo. Just two bottlings which are unnecessary.
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Postby Spirit of Islay » Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:54 pm

Well they must be doing something right , they've got us lot talking about them on 5 different threads on the top page of the Question and Answer section ! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby Lawrence » Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:55 pm

vitara7 wrote:yeh but lawrance, those bottings lsited in the book are those not in total? most of those youll struggle to find in shops etc these days and many are from years back. remember bruichladdich has only been on the go in its current form for a few years, and all those bottles are freely avalable from them, making them not really that limited at all...


Bruichladdich quite clearly state that their bottling runs are very, very small when compared to the rest of the industry. 7200 bottles for Celtic Nations is tiny comapared to Aberlour a'bunadh at 80,000 to 100,000 bottles for each batch run. I'm quite happy that they are not simply dumping all the caks into 5 runs and call them the 12, 15, 17 Port Wood etc etc. We get to see the differences, it's great for the consumer, we have choice. They're not doing things much differently than many other distilleries.
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Postby Jan » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:09 pm

Honestly I does not understand what all the fuss is about. It's their whisky. They can do with it what they like. Which includes pouring it on bottles and selling it. Or not.

If one does not like their product, or the number of available expressions you can just vote with your wallet.

From a business perspective I admire them a lot. They have really done well for them selves, marketingwise. As one poster notes: At the moment 5 threads discussing their products - thats not bad at all...

Just my two cents...
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Postby Mustardhead » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:18 pm

Lawrence wrote:I have a hard time understanding why people complain about wide choice, it does you no harm after all, you're not forced to buy all their bottlings. But I like wide choice.


Excellent point. Even though I am determined to live forever (so far, so good) I probably won't manage to try every whisky :( But I love having so much choice.

Bruichladdich is a very confusing distillery though. I can understand those who take the mickey out of them and I can understand the puzzlement over the price of some recent very young offerings.

But, if for you there are too many weird bottlings called something like CC4D or Old Trafford, just ignore them and pick an Ardbeg or a Macallan or a Highland Park or.... ;)

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Postby The Fachan » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:20 pm

Lawrence,

I would say that A'bunadh is a slightly different case, there is no claim made of it being a limited edition just only available in batches, might just be a matter of interpretation but the runs are nowhere near 80,000 bottles a time.
Hopefully its a different perspective or maybe I am just being a little picky(apologies to Mr.T's alter-ego)


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Postby vitara7 » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:23 pm

to be honest, im thinking bruichladdich is like marmite now. i used to admire them, but now i think personally is getting a bit anyyoying. i for one will be voting with my wallet and hope others do as well. im diffrent to most folk on here, im a serious collector as opposed to a drinker, i look at there stratiges diffrent to a drinker, i look at long term growth of the value of the product as an investment (somthing 90% of folk on here will get pissed of at me about) and to be honest, i see very little or no future prospect from an invesment oppertunity in these newer bruichladdich bottlings, - thats the point im trying to put accross.

from a drinker point, yeh its good trying bruichlladich whisky in all these fancy finishes etc etc, but surly it looses the essacne of what bruichladdich is as there will be no deffinactive bruichladdich with all these changes. i mean, a definatve macallan is the sherry 18yo or ardbeg 10y. but with bruichladdich and there white chochlate and walnut whip cask finished whiskies, what is a deffinative and standard bruichladdich? surly if there whisky was so shit hot, they could keep it as standard, but due to them having so many crap casks then so many good ones and not much between, thats why so many need to re-finished as there not good enough without being finished, or ace'd as they put it.
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Postby Spirit of Islay » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:57 pm

vitara7 wrote:.......and there white chochlate and walnut whip cask finished whiskies.......

Now there's an idea , could you bite the walnut of the top and try and lick the whisky out with your tongue like what you do with the original whips cream ? :wink:

Seriously , there seems like a lot of fuss about nothing , as has been stated they do small runs (unlike a limited Edition Fiddich that i think had 67,500 bottles !) , they don't overly price on most (WMD's , links etc tho i will say the PC5 was a bit overpriced IMHO as are a few of the other older releases but thats Whisky life at the moment) . I don't agee with all this aceing especially on a perfectly good 1970 that was stunning when we tried it at the festival but then again why do Glenmo , Springbank et all do it as well ( not just distilleries i hasten to add....) ?
But on the whole i've thoroughly enjoyed their products that have been released so far and the journey they've taken me on .
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Postby Scotchio » Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:20 pm

I'd have said one step beyond...but that would be madness.
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Postby hpulley » Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:26 pm

Spirit of Islay wrote:Well they must be doing something right , they've got us lot talking about them on 5 different threads on the top page of the Question and Answer section ! :lol: :lol: :lol:


There's no such thing as bad press, they say, but I too long for another nice bourbon casked laddie. I could make the Glen Breton experiment now but why ruin good single malt whiskies by doing that?

vitara7, the entire LCBO is doing you a favor then as we don't have any new laddies at all and likely won't get any more in the near or distant future. Largest single beverage alcohol buyer in the world isn't buying any... I wish I could try the new 12yo among others though :(

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Postby vitara7 » Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:57 pm

LCBO?
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Postby hpulley » Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:09 am

vitara7 wrote:LCBO?


Liquor Control Board of Ontario. Buys all the alcohol for the most populous province in Canada, thus making it the single largest beverage alcohol buyer in the world. We haven't had a new shipment of Bruichladdich in ages -- still have a few bottles of 1st edition 15yo on the shelves and I think our only Links bottling is St. Andrew, though I'm not certain on that one.

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Postby vitara7 » Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:13 am

surley thats good news, you can then buy somthing else instead
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Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:14 am

There are about 2,000 barrels of Stitzel-Weller Distillery (famed and lamented, but defunct since 1992) bourbon residing in Buffalo Trace warehouses in Kentucky that are owned by Diageo and will become part of the base for Crown Royal, the popular Canadian whisky. Nothing wrong with that (other than the fact that some of us would like to taste it as bourbon) as long as they don't call it something it's not when bottled.
Seems like Bruichladdich isn't calling this new bottling 'Scotch'. Seems a pity to miss out on what might be a very fine bottling because one doesn't like the source of it.
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Postby TheLiquorBaron » Mon Dec 04, 2006 1:39 am

TNbourbon wrote:There are about 2,000 barrels of Stitzel-Weller Distillery (famed and lamented, but defunct since 1992) bourbon residing in Buffalo Trace warehouses in Kentucky that are owned by Diageo and will become part of the base for Crown Royal, the popular Canadian whisky. Nothing wrong with that (other than the fact that some of us would like to taste it as bourbon)


Ah, see now Tim I would probably have to disagree...There is something wrong with that...speaking from a consumer's point of view - I'm sure the marketing folk at Diageo would(or if they did their homework, Should!) know that if they took those 2000 odd barrels and bottled it as a single barrel Bourbon or even a small batch release, they would find that the cost in doing this as opposed to trying to vatt it would be less and they would find that they would be able to charge a premium price for the bottling.

At least that is what I can see...I would think that most US folk would jump at a single barrelled or small batch release of Stitzel-Weller whisk(e)y
:wink:
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Postby TheLaddie » Mon Dec 04, 2006 2:50 am

vitara7 wrote:what is a deffinative and standard bruichladdich? surly if there whisky was so shit hot, they could keep it as standard, but due to them having so many crap casks then so many good ones and not much between, thats why so many need to re-finished as there not good enough without being finished, or ace'd as they put it.


The outgoing 10yo and the incoming 12yo are both very enjoyable standard bottlings. The 15yo and 20yo are more limited runs.

At the stage the owners are in their ownership what they can offer depends on the stocks distilled by previous owners and the barrels they can aquire. I guess we are not going to see the true standard range of bottlings from Bruichalddich until the stock distilled by the new regime has aged sufficiently and they are making their standard bottlings from spirit distilled in their own style.

Personally I'd rather they released 21 bottlings and I get to try 10, than they only release 5. I have 5 OB Laddies open on my shelf right now, all different and all good enjoyable malts.

Good luck to them. I'd much rather give my money to them than Diageo or Pernod Richard.
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Postby Deactivated Member » Mon Dec 04, 2006 6:17 am

Bruichladdich are doing it, so it must be wrong.
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Postby hpulley » Mon Dec 04, 2006 2:23 pm

vitara7 wrote:surley thats good news, you can then buy somthing else instead


Less choice is never good news for a consumer. I'm confused why anyone would think so.

Do people have personal vendettas against distilleries? Again, I'm confused why anyone would. If you don't like something, then don't buy it. Spending time getting other people not to buy it will, I suppose with enough traction, perhaps benefit some other distillery but again I am quite confused as to the purpose.

Harry
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Postby les taylor » Mon Dec 04, 2006 3:14 pm

Clever marketing strategy I'd call it.



:)
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Postby TreacleSponge » Mon Dec 04, 2006 5:24 pm

TheLaddie wrote:The outgoing 10yo and the incoming 12yo are both very enjoyable standard bottlings. The 15yo and 20yo are more limited runs.

...

Personally I'd rather they released 21 bottlings and I get to try 10, than they only release 5.




Couldn't agree more, I think they're doing a great job :)
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